David Ouma Ochieng'

Serjeant-at-Arms, ring the Quorum I order that the Quorum Bell be stopped. Clerk-at-the-Table, proceed. Leader of the Majority Party, go ahead.

We have a list in the Order Paper. The first chance goes to Hon. Adhe Wario. Is he in the House? Go ahead. INADEQUATE ADMINISTRATIVE UNITS IN NORTH HORR

Is the Chairperson or the Vice- Chairperson of that Committee in? Whip of the Majority Party, if you cannot whip your chairpersons to the House, who will you whip? Your chairpersons are persistently not in this House when the House starts. What is your job?

That is not my issue. My issue is that your chairpersons are persistently not in the House when the House begins. (Hon. Wanami Wamboka spoke off the record) Order! Hon. Wamboka. It is not your business. It is my business. I would like to know from you why your chairpersons...

And I am communicating that it is completely out of order for your chairpersons not to be in the House. It does not matter. The chairpersons must be in the House when the House begins every single sitting day. I order that this Request for Statement be answered by the...

Next is Hon. Farah Yussuf. Is Hon. Caroli Omondi in?

Which wananchi are they representing, and they are not in the House?

Okay. Go ahead. DEMISE OF ENG. ROBERT MAGOTSI IN MOZAMBIQUE

The Chairperson of the Committee on Defence, Intelligence and Foreign Relations. (Hon. Caroline Ng’elechei and Hon. Marianne Kitany consulted with Hon. Nelson Koech) The Member for Elgeyo Marakwet and the Member for Aldai were engaged in conversation with the Chairperson. The Chairman has just been asked a question, and I...

I will let you sit down. (Laughter)

That Member will move from her seat. Please, Member for Elgeyo Marakwet, change your seat so that the Chairperson can listen. Now, go ahead.

The matter relates to the death of a Kenyan in Mozambique. How long do you need to deal with this?

Hon. Caleb Amisi, you have heard what the Chairperson has said. I also advise you to speak with him and provide the details so he can have the complete picture as the Committee prepares to respond to you. Is that agreeable?

Next is Hon. Charles Kamuren. EFFECTS OF RISING WATER LEVELS IN LAKES BARINGO AND BOGORIA

Return to that Committee. I will not ask the Chairperson to respond. Go to your Committee and raise this question yourself, ensuring that it is handled comprehensively with your leadership. If you have been following House proceedings, you would know that this matter was discussed comprehensively last week and was...

Order, order. That is true and that is why, even knowing that you are the Vice-Chairman, I still allowed you to read your Statement. I did not stop you because you need your constituents to know that you are raising an issue on the Floor, but you are in a...

Order. Hon. Kamuren is not just a Vice-Chairman. He is also the Member for Baringo South. He is entitled to ask the question he has raised on the Floor acting on behalf of the people of Baringo South. I think that ends the matter of Statements. Hon. Makilap, what is...

The matter will be handled appropriately as directed by the Speaker. In any case, Hon. Kamuren can raise this with the Prime Cabinet Secretary too. Hon. Members, before we move to the next Order, let us welcome students from the following schools in the Public Gallery: Lugulu Boarding Primary School,...

Thank you. Hon. Wario.

Thank you. Hon. Ng’ikor, go ahead.

The Vice-Chairman of the

Next is the Member for Kabuchai. Hon. Members, please, anyone who does not have a card should get it and log in. Allow me as the presiding Chair of this session to follow the order that you used to log in.

Order! Take your seat, Hon Osoro. Hon. Jack Wamboka, this House will listen to Hon. Majimbo in silence. Hon. Majimbo will remain relevant in his submissions. You know very well that we are no longer in the old constitutional dispensation. We are in the new constitutional dispensation that gives Parliament...

Hon. Members, I know the issues before us are emotive. Therefore, let us be factual. I have listened to Hon. Majimbo refer to Clause 169, but it is not there. So… (Hon. Majimbo Kalasinga stood up in his place) Order, Hon. Majimbo! Just sit down. Every Member in this House...

Thank you very much. I am happy to listen to Hon. Mwenje because he has spoken for about 10 minutes without attacking anybody or going outside the script. He has done very well. If you all do as he did, we will have a very good debate. Hon. Jack Wamboka,...

Hon. Members, you will agree with me that I have given this side four uninterrupted opportunities. Therefore, I will also give the other side four opportunities. Thereafter, we shall return to this side. I have to be fair to the House. It does not matter what you do about that...

Where is your card, Hon. Maina? (Hon. Amos Maina spoke off the record) I cannot see it. You are not supposed to stand up and raise your hand. You insert your card in the intervention slot. Proceed, Hon. Kitany.

Point made. In my opinion, that is a point of debate, which you may raise when you get an opportunity to contribute. Go ahead, Hon. Kitany.

Let us have Hon. Osoro.

Well said. Hon. Cynthia Muge.

Thank you. Hon. Members, today we have students visiting us from Kyamboo Secondary School from Mwingi West Constituency, Kitui County; and Jansil Junior School in Kajiado North, Kajiado County. They are seated in the Public Gallery. We also have students from Al-Ansaaru Nursery and Primary School in Kamukunji Constituency, Nairobi...

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. This is neither the first nor the last Finance Bill. In fact, we have had numerous Finance Acts in operation over the years. Therefore, it is wrong to say that this Finance Bill alone is intended to raise Ksh4.29 trillion. It is not....

Let us have Hon. Jematiah.

Hon. Mwenje.

Thank you. Hon. Nyikal. Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal (Seme, ODM) As I rise to support this, I want to bring to our attention that I have noted staff in our constituency offices do not have a health cover other than the National Hospital Insurance Fund (NHIF) which they had then,...

Sorry about that. Just do another memo. Hon. Members, I now put the question. (Programmes 0723000 and 0746000 agreed to) (Vote 2043 agreed to) VOTE 2044 - SENATE

Hon. Nyikal, lastly.

Member for Lugari.

Hon. Member for Yatta.

Let us have the Member for Vihiga County. (Hon. Mishi Mboko spoke off the record) Order, Hon. Mishi Mboko. You know how I chair the House. You will get a chance to speak. Let her have her time. You will get an opportunity to contribute after she has finished.

Proceed,

Member for Marakwet West. Hon. Timothy Kipchumba (Marakwet West, Independent) : Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for granting me the opportunity to comment on the Budget Estimates for the Financial Year 2026/2027. From the outset, I thank the Committee for the report they have tabled. In my opinion, it is...

Thank you. Member for Masinga.

Thank you. We will have Hon. Peter Orero, followed by Hon. Catherine Omanyo from this side. Then, from this other side, after Hon. Omanyo, we will move to Hon. Marianne Kitany, followed by Hon. Adams, then Hon. Sigei. Go ahead, Member for Kibra.

Thank you. Member for Busia County.

Let us have the Member for Aldai.

Very well said. The Member for Keiyo North.

Which Standing Order has been infringed?

Order.

Order! There is no Standing Order that has been flouted. Therefore, you are out of order. We will have the Member for Sotik, followed by the Member for Kapenguria.

Hon. Adams Korir, kindly take your seat. Hon. Members, this debate will ultimately be put to a vote. Going forward, I will not allow any Member to speak and then leave the Chamber. Who will decide on the fate of the Motion once we conclude the debate? It is out...

If I remember very well, the late Hon. Malulu Injendi’s Motion was passed by the House. The Bill has not been passed. (Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu spoke off the record) Order. Hon. Makali Mulu, I will give you a chance to contribute to this matter so that you appreciate the...

Thank you. Next is the Member for Kapenguria.

Next is the Member for Nyatike, who will be followed by Hon. Kaguchia. Thereafter, we will come to this side.

Thank you. Next is Hon. Kaguchia.

Order, Chairperson of the Budget and Appropriations Committee.

You have made your point. Hon. Kaguchia, proceed.

Member for Moiben, our time is almost up. I will indulge you if you can take three minutes. The Member for Turbo will follow for another three minutes. Hon. Mogaka will also have three minutes.

Let us have the Member for Turbo.

Hon. Mogaka, you have three minutes.

Thank you. Hon. Members, that marks the end of the Third Allotted Day for debate on this particular Motion. I, therefore, call upon the Mover to reply.

Hon. Members, I proceed to put the question. (Question put and agreed to) ADJOURNMENT Hon. Members, the time being Published by Clerk of the National Assembly Parliament Buildings

Sergeant-at-Arms, please, ring the Quorum Bell for 10 minutes. (The Quorum Bell was rung) I order that the Bell be rung for a further five minutes. (The Quorum Bell was rung) Hon Members, when the Quorum Bell is ringing, you cannot leave the House. Sergeants-at-Arms are advised to enforce that...

Thank you. Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Security. Is there any Member from that Committee? (Hon. Protus Akujah stood up in his place) Is that Hon. Akujah? Did you hear the question?

Hon. Mnyazi, take it up with him and his Committee and ensure that you raise it again in the first week after we come back from recess. Hon. Kassim Tandaza, what is out of order?

Okay. Next Order. PROCEDURAL MOTION EXEMPTION OF CERTAIN BUSINESS FROM STANDING ORDER 40(3) Whip of the Majority Party.

Hon. Adagala.

Order, Hon Members. (Question proposed) Hon. Members, is it the mood to put the Question?

Hon. Members, debate on this Bill was finalised. (Question put and agreed to) (The Bill was read a Second Time and committed to Committee of the whole House) THE PREVENTION OF LIVESTOCK AND PRODUCE THEFT BILL (Question put and agreed to)Debate on this Bill had been finalised.(The Bill was read...

Next is Hon. Jayne Kihara followed by Hon. Mary Wamaua.

Hon. Wamaua.

Well said. Hon. Members. Remember last week when the Cabinet Secretary for Education was here, the questions we sent him back with are the exact issues in this Motion, almost word for word. Hon. Mathenge, you were here last week and you had the same questions for the Cabinet Secretary...

Hon. Omboko, you know that that is quite unprocedural. You will have to come back. Our procedures require that when Cabinet Secretaries come, they first answer Questions that had been asked, then we proceed with supplementary questions. So, you will indulge us to deal with your matter last. At this...

Cabinet Secretary, in summary, the Leader of the Majority Party is asking whether the Ministry has lost control of school heads and principals. Can you do anything about it? Write them down. Other questions will be asked on school uniforms. Members, please, the Cabinet Secretary has several questions to answer....

That is okay. Proceed, Hon. Martin.

Hon. Mathenge.

Thank you, Hon. Mathenge. Member for Samburu, Hon. Pauline Lenguris, please, make it short so that we can have as many Members as we can.

Hon. Member for Magarini.

Hon. Wamuchomba.

Thank you. Hon. Member for Suba South.

Thank you. The Member for Loima.

Members, I am just following the interventions as they are. I never skip anyone. Hon. Alice Ng’anga, go ahead.

Hon. Omboko, please, make it a minute so that we finish with this question.

I will have two more Members: Hon. Gisairo, the Member for Busia and the Member for Teso South.

Hon. Omanyo.

Hon. Emaase, a minute. The Cabinet Secretary has seven questions to go. So, if you do not ask on this one, you can ask on the next. Go ahead.

Asante. Hon. Muchangi.

Let us have Hon. Kwenya, and then Hon Emathe.

He has not been bashed by anybody.

Hon. Emathe.

Next is Hon. Naomi Waqo.

Let us have Hon. Mishi Mboko.

Lastly, let us have the Member for West Mugirango. Members, you will get a chance to ask your questions in the second round.

Cabinet Secretary, most Members have raised similar questions, so I expect a short response. The Cabinet Secretary for Education (Mr Julius Ogamba) : Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker and Members. I want to be very frank about this issue of school uniforms. It has been a thorn in parents’ flesh...

Let him finish. Proceed. The Cabinet Secretary for Education (Mr Julius Ogamba) : The Ministry may issue a directive to ban lunch programmes if it takes the direction of uniforms. However, we have indicated that no child should be sent home for failure to pay for lunch. That is the...

Thank you. Hon. Members, this matter ends there. Cabinet Secretary, take the rostrum again and give us a final decision on what is possible on uniforms, lunch, reams of paper, desks and punishment. It is not July anymore. The Cabinet Secretary for Education (Mr Julius Ogamba) : Thank you, Hon....

Hon. Gachagua, this is a chance for follow-up questions on the matter of payment of invigilators, supervisors and examiners. It is not an open-ended chance. So, I would request that you ask a question related to that.

Hon. Omboko, this was not a question in the manner you are saying. It was an issue that was raised in the plenary by the whole House. Go ahead.

Thank you. Hon. Member for Molo.

Hon. Kimani Kuria, no. We cannot do this. This is spent. Before you sit down, I had hoped, because this is an area in which you are well versed, that this would be a perfect example where, for the first time, Parliament, not the Executive, would move to use Article...

Thank you. Hon. Mukunji.

Thank you. Hon. Taitumu.

Hon. Ikiara.

Thank you. Hon. Emaase, do you want to speak to this?

Thank you. Hon. Kombe.

Thank you. Hon. Passaris.

Thank you. Hon. (Dr) Mutunga.

Hon. Caroli, do you want to ask a follow-up question on this?

Cabinet Secretary, you have heard the questions. In your response, include whether this money that you said you do not have was budgeted for. I do not agree with the issue of the Supplementary Budget. Was this included in the main budget for the Financial Year 2025/2026? The Cabinet Secretary...

Hon. Mary Emaase said something very important. All of us know that every single year, exams are done and they are invigilated, supervised and marked. This has become a crisis every single year. Cabinet Secretary, I hope you got your answer back. The Cabinet Secretary for Education (Mr Julius Ogamba)...

Thank you. Cabinet Secretary, we are all in this position. The Ministry knows that this will be a crisis and money will be found. Every single year, the Ministry leaves it pending, teachers cry, it becomes a crisis and thereafter you have to look for money. It is a bad...

Cabinet Secretary, you have 14 days. We can get an answer by next Thursday and if you need the intervention of Parliament to make the National Treasury act, please, write to the Speaker so that this is expedited. The Cabinet Secretary for Education (Mr Julius Ogamba) : I am well...

Well said. Hon. Mutunga, it is now your chance to contribute.

Since you are an academician, before you go, having listened to the debate this afternoon, we had institutions called Kenya Science and Kenya Polytechnic. How do you guard against what happened to those two institutions, because they also specialised in their respective fields?

They elevated Kenya Science and Kenya Polytechnic to university status. How can you protect this from also being inflated by all these things you are talking about?

It is now the chance for… Is it Mr, Dr, or Professor Oundo?

Thank you. Hon. Wandeto.

Order. I do not mind giving you information. However, when a Member is on a roll, and you can clearly see it, and then you interrupt, it is not fair. Do you want to be informed by him?

Hon. Wandeto, next time someone has a point of information, it is courteous to allow them to inform you. Hon. Kimaiyo. (Hon. Joshua Kimilu spoke off the record) Order. There is a Member in this House called Hon. Kimaiyo, and this chance belongs to him.

Let us have Hon. Joshua Kimilu.

Hon. Shakeel, please take your seat. You will contribute after Hon. Kimilu. You came to me because you did not have your card, and he had already put in his card. That is how it works.

Order. You know, I allowed you to say what you said, even though it was irrelevant. But when you veer off course, you know I will not allow you. I allowed you because you started the process. But please do not go beyond what you have already said. Be relevant...

Order. You know none of the Members here is in Kisumu, and none of them attacked Senator Osotsi. Why can you not be relevant to this matter? I sympathise with Hon. Osotsi like you, but if you want to discuss that, you can bring a Motion, please.

Hon. Shabbir.

Hon. Leo Wa Muthende Njeru.

Member for Yatta.

Member for Suba North, followed by the Member for Seme and then Hon. Mayaka in that order.

Thank you. Hon. Lekakeny, do you want to speak on this? I have not seen your card. (Hon. Julius Sunkuli spoke off the record) Okay, great. Then this is your chance, Hon. Nyikal.

Hon. Mayaka, followed by the Member for Malindi, then the Member for Marakwet West.

Member for Malindi.

From my records, honourable

That said, I think it is time for the mover to reply. Hon. Gichimu.

I have always wondered why Members leave the Chamber after they contribute. Who is supposed to make a decision on the business under consideration if you leave the Chamber? I have observed each Member who contributed to the Motion leaving the Chamber soon thereafter. (Putting the question deferred) Hon. Maungu,...

Hon. Maungu, you just walked in. When did you count the Members present? Ring the Quorum Bell for 10 minutes. The Whip of the Minority Party, approach the Temporary Speaker. Serjeant-at-Arms, it has been more than 10 minutes. You can stop ringing the Quorum Bell. Hon. Members, for obvious reasons,...

Hon. Member for Chepalungu Constituency, do you want to say something on this?

Hon. Wandeto.

Hon. Ibrahim Saney.

Hon. David Kiplagat of Soy. There being no further interest on this, could we request the Mover to reply?

Hon. Chepkonga, please, put the facts straight.

Hon. Members, the decision on this matter will be made the next time it is in the Order Paper for obvious reasons.

Is it true that we do not quorate? I, therefore, order that the Quorum Bell be rung for the next 10 minutes. (The Quorum Bell was rung) Hon. Members, having rung the bell for the last 10 minutes and failing to achieve quorum, I order that it be stopped. ADJOURNMENT...