Johnson Arthur Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja Next Order!

Hon. Senators, pursuant to Standing Order 232 (1) , the Petition is committed to the Standing Committee on Land, Environment and Natural Resources, which is the relevant Standing Committee, for its consideration. In terms of Standing Order 232, the Committee is required in not more than 60 calendar days from...

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I want to congratulate Sen. Farhiya for this Statement. I think all of us agree that we have a problem, especially on pending bills with our national and county governments. I am aware that pending bills for counties are approaching a figure of...

The next Statement is by Sen. Farhiya. STATUS OF PENDING BILLS AT BOTH NATIONAL AND COUNTY GOVERNMENT LEVELS

Sen. Sakaja Mr. Speaker, Sir, is it a coincidence? I completely agree with Sen. Omogeni on the many things he has said including Inshallah being governor of Nairobi City County next year. He is right that this is an issue for the Senate Committee on Labour and Social Welfare; that...

Sen. Sakaja I agree with her as well.

Sen. Sakaja Mr. Speaker, Sir, they want me to join the United Democratic Alliance (UDA) party. I am glad the Senator of Kericho is here. I have not seen the Senator of Bomet but I have seen Sen. (Dr.) Milgo. Senator of Nyamira, towards the end of this month, my...

Sen. Sakaja Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise pursuant to Standing Order No.48 (1) to seek a Statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources on the demolition of Martin Luther Primary School in Makadara Constituency, Nairobi City County. In this Statement, the Committee should...

Sen. Sakaja On a point of information, Madam Temporary Speaker.

Sen. Sakaja Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. For the sake of record of the House, I would like to inform Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. that he forgot the name of the commission that dealt with boundaries. It was called the Kenya Regional Boundaries Commission of 1962. It was gazetted on...

Sen. Sakaja Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for this opportunity to second this very important piece of legislation. It is actually quite consequential. I congratulate Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. for moving it in this House for the fourth time since he was elected as a Senator. He moved it but...

Sen. Sakaja Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish to join my colleagues in giving the youngest Senator in the House my sincere congratulations on his nomination. I have already been impressed by two things. One, the way he handled his nomination. It will be recalled that on the unfortunate passing away...

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. SakajaIs it in order for it to be on the record of the House that someone said that it is a product of the ‘handshake’ or should that phrase be withdrawn?One day, the children and grandchildren of Sen. Madzayo will look at the HANSARD and they will say that...

Point taken. Yes, Sen. Cherargei.

Madam Deputy Speaker, is it in order, for Sen. Sakaja to tell us that the award of Sen. Madzayo---

By the way, we do not counter a point of order. You make your own point of order.

Madam Deputy Speaker is it in order for us to even discuss yet we know that there is a process that is undertaken to get those awards?

That is a very default way of---

Madam Deputy Speaker, it is a statement of fact, what Sen. (Dr.) Langat stated.

Senator, you will get your own opportunity. We had congratulated the Members. The first one has come in. We are waiting for three more. The process is still on, and we should congratulate our colleagues. Let us not add anything. Sen. (Dr.) Langat, if you added something else, that is...

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I actually thought that Sen. Cherargei would stand in defense of his own name. I heard Sen. (Dr.) Langat asking the Deputy Speaker to protect him from “this noisemaker, Sen. Cherargei.” Is Sen. Cherargei saying that he is a noisemaker in the House?

Senator, you are now making me hear what I did not hear. Hon. Senators, let us put this to rest. Let us support and congratulate our colleagues. We know that this is very senior judge. He should have gotten it a long time ago. We congratulate you, Sen. Madzayo. We...

Asante, Bi, Naibu Spika. Langu ni kuwa ulimwambia Sen. (Dkt.) Langat kuwa maneno hayo si mazuri na ayaondoe ndio yaondolewe katika rekodi zetu. Lakini, yeye alikuambia asante na akaendelea kuongea. Ni vizuri umkumbushe ayaondoe matamshi hayo.

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. SakajaThe third one, which we always focus on is the inter-governmental fiscal transfers; the revenue sharing that we debate here in this Parliament. We normally do that before we look at number one and two. Number one says what we should do and what this other level should do....

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja Madam Temporary Speaker, as I said, the remittances are like two sides of a coin. There is the good and the bad but we must applaud those Kenyans. We must recognise and treat them with the honour and the respect they deserve by bringing services closer to them....

That is good luck. Continue with your contribution because we were enjoying listening to you. Sen. Sakaja Madam Temporary Speaker, as I said, the remittances are like two sides of a coin. There is the good and the bad but we must applaud those Kenyans. We must recognise and treat...

Sen. Sakaja, there is a point or order from Sen. Omogeni.

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. My good friend, the Senator for Bomet, has just crossed the Floor from this to the other side. I know he belongs to the “hustler nation,” but when we are in Parliament, he has to follow the Standing Orders. The Temporary Speaker...

Thank you, Sen. Omogeni, for being alert. Sen. (Dr.) Langat, kindly do the needful. (Sen. (Dr.) Langat bowed to the Chair) Thank you, Sen. (Dr.) Langat. September 30, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 31

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, I am a bit perturbed by the very sensible intervention by Sen. Farhiya. I am perturbed not because it is sensible, but because she is the Deputy Senate Majority Whip. If anything, there should be no list in this House without consulting her. As a...

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja The reason I asked you for confirmation earlier is because the information is that when you went to consult in the office, it was clear you were to withdraw the Notice of Motion in preference to a Statement, so that there is an in-depth investigation into the issues...

Thank you, Sen. Sakaja, you have said it well. According to Standing Order 56 (1) - “A Notice of Motion may be withdrawn by the Senator who gave the notice.” That was his choice. We wanted to confirm what he had done. He withdrew the Motion because the concern of...

Madam Deputy Speaker, I said that I will discuss with your office to withdraw my Motion – to postpone and not withdraw. Probably to postpone and amend it. I am not saying that I am withdrawing the Notice of Motion. This is why I requested you to defer the issuance...

The reason I asked you for confirmation earlier is because the information is that when you went to consult in the office, it was clear you were to withdraw the Notice of Motion in preference to a Statement, so that there is an in-depth investigation into the issues that you...

Madam Deputy Speaker, I rise to request a Statement on the influx of persons of Asian origin into the country. From the onset, I would like to state that I do not subscribe to xenophobia behaviour. However, as a representative of the people of this country, I have to raise...

Hon. Senators, as you have noticed, we are committing all the three statements that have been read to Committees without Senators commenting on them due to time constraints. We will discuss the statements when the respective Committees table the reports of the findings. Next Order. THE COUNTY RESOURCE DEVELOPMENT BILL...

Next Order. ADOPTION OF THE REPORT ON THE PUBLIC FINANCE MANAGEMENT (EQUALIZATION FUND ADMINISTRATION) REGULATIONS, 2021 September 29, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 14

THAT, the Senate adopts the Report of the Sessional Committee on Delegated Legislation on the Public Finance Management (Equalization Fund Administration) Regulations, 2021, Legal Notice No. 54 of 2021, laid on the Table of the Senate on Tuesday, 28th September, 2021; and pursuant to Section 205 (4) of the Public...

Hon. Senators, this is a resumption of debate that was interrupted yesterday. Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki has eight minutes left. Kindly proceed, Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki.

Madam Deputy Speaker, before the House adjourned last night, I was making the point that rural poverty is not the same as urban poverty. The dynamic, circumstances, implications and the consequences of rural poverty are very different from those of urban poverty. You can have a very poor person without...

regulations were compelled by a court of law after the National Treasury wasted a lot of time on an issue that should have happened many years ago. I dare say that the Judiciary has really helped in the entrenchment of devolution. This House itself is a beneficiary of so many...

Madam Deputy Speaker, I rise under Standing Order No.105 (1) and move that the debate now be adjourned. The reason for this is that we would like to spend a moment with the Members to discuss the whole issue of Committees and turn ourselves into a Kamukunji inside the House...

Madam Deputy Speaker, as I speak today, there are some Committees which cannot meet, one of them being the Committee for Devolved Governments and Intergovernmental Relations. In fact, it has been more than one and a half months since they had a proper meeting. There are many other Committees which...

One of the issues to be resolved should be that if you are in the leadership like I am, you should not be a Chairperson of a Committee. As a general rule, you should not be. It becomes very difficult for a Member in CPAIC to be in three other...

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja Hon. Senators, the putting of the question is deferred until a later date. (Putting of the question on the Motion deferred)

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Thank you very much Sen. Olekina and Sen. Cherargei. I also thank Sen. Were who gave very good contributions. Sen. Orengo as well had a lot to say and many who wanted to speak had a lot to say. I know Sen....

Sen. Cherargei, proceed.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I congratulate Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. and Sen. Sakaja for this wonderful Bill. I think for Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr., we were together in investigation of the disaster in Solai Dam. He was the Vice Chairperson of the Committee on National Security, Defence and...

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Let me thank the two distinguished Senators. The Senator from the city, Sen. Sakaja and Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. for actually thinking about something that should have been done long time ago. When we served with these two distinguished gentlemen, in the ad hoc...

There is no point of spending money to do other Government projects instead of putting that money aside to fund disaster management. Today we are told that about Kshs15 billion of the Petroleum Development Levy Fund (PDLF) has been used to fund other government projects instead of cushioning Kenyans.Mr. Temporary...

Hon. Senators, I defer putting of question until a later date. (Putting of the question on the Bill deferred) September 29, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 43 ADJOURNMENT

Hon. Senators, it is now 6.30

Sen. Sakaja Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. This is a matter that no one should even request the Committee on Education to take up. The Committee, on its own Motion, should have been on this matter. There is a huge outcry from our teachers. I have received a lot of...

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, the Chairperson of Committee on Education and the Senator who sought the Statement are the ones consulting loudly. There is merit in continuous professional development. We should not sound like we are discouraging that from the teachers. It must continue. It is encouraged in all...

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, you need to direct because, indeed, there could be a word that is not parliamentary. However, you can direct, so that we do not September 28, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 19 Sen. Sakajarepeat it, that the Clerks-at-the-Table go through the HANSARD and withdraw from the record...

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, I request for a Statement on the arbitrary killings of innocent boda boda riders by the police in Nairobi City County. I rise, pursuant to Standing Order 48 (1) , to seek a statement from the Standing Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations...

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, by the end of my submission, it will be clear whether I support or oppose this. We appreciate that it has been many years that Article 204 has provided for the Equalization Fund to bring up to speed the general level enjoyed by the country...

Sen. Sakaja It does!

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, it does.

Sen. Sakaja I have not accepted.

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, I am not interested anymore. Let me give my argument.

Sen. Sakaja I still have time. How much time do I have?

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, we have rules on how long a contribution is done. This is not a Statement, but a report. When we discuss a report, we passed how much time someone can speak. I still have time.

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, first of all, those were points of argument. I would like to convince my colleagues that in the Senate, when we debate, you do not have to agree with what I am saying. Just because you do not agree with it, does not mean it...

Sen. Sakaja I thank my sister because she sees the point. There is no way I can support the implementation of something that I see as completely unfair. The regulations are giving effect to the implementation of the marginalisation policy. How would you support that and tell your people in...

Sen. Sakaja Madam Temporary Speaker, I have always assumed that the Senate Majority Leader knows his truths. He knows who knows what happened. Just because something that I opposed then passed, does not mean that I accept it now. If it was unfair then, it is still unfair now and...

Sen. Sakaja On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. It takes two to tango. I will, therefore, do what they have done. Is it in order for Sen. Olekina to mislead this House that there is a difference between neglect in what I am talking about; that the national...

Sen. Sakaja On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker.

Sen. Sakaja Madam Temporary Speaker, yes, it is Standing Order No.72. Could the Clerk give me a copy of the Standing Orders.

Sen. Sakaja Madam Temporary Speaker, it is not Standing Order No. 72, but 115 on irrelevance. September 28, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 39 Sen. SakajaIs the Senator for Narok relevant by misleading the House that I have anything against children from counties that are gaining by saying that the children of...

Sen. Sakaja On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker.

Sen. Sakaja Madam Temporary Speaker, is the Senator for Narok in order to keep misleading the House in defining what marginalized is. His statement is that marginalization is not poverty. However, poverty is as a result of marginalization. The dictionary defines marginalized as a person, group or concept treated as...

Sen. Sakaja The regulations will be passed. You will have 24 votes, but I will vote ‘no’. Do not try to convince me. Talk to other Senators and not me. (Sen. Olekina consulted loudly)

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. SakajaA September 23, 2021 SENATE DEBATES Sen. Sakaja

Do you want to debate your Statement? Sen. Sakaja No, I am giving you the context.

You just read the Statement and others will make comments. Sen. Sakaja No, I am not talking on the same.

Okay. Sen. Sakaja The Members of the Committee on Health will tell you that today the NMS came to the Committee and they were giving answers to a similar question from Sen. Kwamboka who is also one of the Senators whom we assist each other in Nairobi, but the answers...

I will allow very few comments---

On a point of order Madam Temporary Speaker

What is your point of order, Sen. (Dr.) Ali?

Madam Temporary Speaker, it is a point of information. I want to inform the hon. Senator---

Are you informing him while he is already through?

It concerns the same issue because I am a Member of the Committee. We disagreed with what the NMS brought. We told them that in the next two weeks they should come up with a proper response, very well informed and detailed.

Was it on the same subject?

Yes, it was on the same subject of Mbagathi hospital. We had a meeting with the NMS this morning, but they did not come with proper answers. We told them we did not want one line answers, but proper and comprehensive ones concerning the ICU, oxygen and everything that happens...

I will allow a few comments because we have a lot of business before us.

Bi. Spika wa Muda, swali hili lililoletwa na Sen. Sakaja ambaye ni Seneta wa Kaunti ya Jiji la Nairobi ni la maana sana. Kwanza kabisa hali ya afya katika kaunti zetu, si Nairobi tu, iko na shida kubwa sana. Sijui hali ya Kisumu Kaunti unapotoka, Bi. Spika wa Muda, lakini...

A kuiba pesa. Hii ni kwa sababu kazi ya afya haina njia ya kuiba kupitia ujenzi. Wengi wao wanaiba pesa ya kununua dawa moja kwa moja kutoka akaunti ya kaunti. Sen. Sakaja ameleta taarifa nzuri sana. Ningependa nimkumbushe siku ile nilikuwa hapa katika Meza hii ya Siwa nikisema kwamba serikali...

What is your point of order, Sen. Cherargei and under which Standing Order?

Bi. Spika wa Muda, ningependa Seneta ambaye ni mwalimu wangu-- -

Under which Standing Order?

Kwa Kiswahili ni hoja ya nidhamu. Sen. Murkomen anamaanisha nini anaposema jeshi kwa sababu Kenya hii tuna Jeshi la Wokovu, Jeshi la ‘mahustler’ na kadhalika. Ni vyema afafanunue ili Wakenya wasichanganyikiwe.

Sen. Murkomen, be clear.

Bi. Spika wa Muda, unajua kwamba kaunti ya Jiji la Nairobi inasimamiwa na meja jenerari wa jeshi la taifa la Kenya. Si kwamba amestaafu bali sasa hivi ni meja jenerari. Tulipoambiwa kuwa kaunti ya Jiji la Nairobi imewekwa kuongozwa na meja jenerari nilileta taarifa hapa nikauliza, “inawezekanaje tulete wanajeshi wetu...

Sen. Sakaja Bi. Spika wa muda, nakubaliana na Sen. Sakaja kuwa kisheria, hakuna yeyote ambaye hawezi kualikwa mbele ya kamati yoyote ya Senenti kuwajibika. Kwa hivyo ni lazima Maj. Gen. Badi afike mbele ya kamati yoyote ya Bunge itakayo mualika kujibu maswali. Hata hivyo, ni jana tu tulikuwa tunajadili hoja...

Bi. Spika wa muda, nakubaliana na Sen. Sakaja kuwa kisheria, hakuna yeyote ambaye hawezi kualikwa mbele ya kamati yoyote ya Senenti kuwajibika. Kwa hivyo ni lazima Maj. Gen. Badi afike mbele ya kamati yoyote ya Bunge itakayo mualika kujibu maswali. Hata hivyo, ni jana tu tulikuwa tunajadili hoja ya kuwashutumu...

Sen. Sakaja Madam Temporary Speaker, I thank you.

Sen. Sakaja Madam Deputy Speaker, I would like to inform Sen. Halake that Article 94 (5) of the Constitution states that: “No person or body, other than Parliament, has the power to make provision having the force of law in Kenya except under authority conferred by this Constitution or by...

Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja: On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I sincerely hope that Sen. Kang’ata is not opposing for the sake of it. This is the last time I will interrupt him. Is it in order for him to mislead the House and contradict himself? He has given...

Sen, Kang’ata, do you want to be informed?

Yes, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Sen. Sakaja Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I want to humbly inform my esteemed colleague from Murang’a County that this Bill does not seek to create a new agency. If you go through it, it brings together the many different small units that have...

Sen, Kang’ata, proceed.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, thank you. I am very happy with that intervention from one of the drafters of this Bill - I think they are two. If I get his intervention and information right, he says that this Bill is creating a body to bring together functions. Maybe the...

A Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, let me give you another example. Look at the tourism sector. How many entities do we have in the tourism sector? We have the Tourism Fund and many other bodies and boards that are dealing with a singular sector called tourism.

What is it, Sen. Sakaja? Sen. Sakaja On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I sincerely hope that Sen. Kang’ata is not opposing for the sake of it. This is the last time I will interrupt him. Is it in order for him to mislead the House and...

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, can I continue? There is information.

Sen. Orengo, proceed. The Senate Minority Leader (

Sen. Sakaja

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Sen. Sakaja

Sen. Sakaja Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I was being tempted to go into Kiswahili since we know limitations. I also rise to support the Motion to censure the Hon. John Munyes, the CS for the Ministry of Petroleum and Mining and Hon. Charles Keter, CS for the Ministry...

Asante kwa kukubaliana na mimi. Kweli bei ya vitu vimepanda na kama mna ufahamu huo nashukuru. Hawa mabwana tunawazungumzia hapa, wao mafuta hununuliwa hata hawajui inauzwa bei gani. Sisi ndio tunapiga kelele tunasema mafuta imepanda lakini wao hawajui. Hivi ving’ora sisi Wabunge ambao tunawakilisha wananchi haturuhusiwi kwenda na kusindikizwa na...

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Sen. Sakaja

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Sen. Sakaja