James Orengo

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) : Madam Temporary Speaker, I know that it was in the context of the Committee on Devolution and Intergovernmental Relations. We have even convinced the organization that I worked for; the World Food Programme (WFP) , to distribute cash instead of relief food. It was...

A are going to be extremely difficult. It is not the debate for now, but I am just telling her that it is a crisis out there.

I think that that case is settled. We need now to hear from Sen. Cherargei. (Sen. Farhiya spoke off record) That is okay. You have one minute.

Madam Temporary Speaker, there is a package that has been invested in some places and, it can even be escalated. Right now, you can actually give Safaricom the money and the charges. It is very clear where that money goes. The reason why money is much more important is because...

She is on a point of order, please. Just finish your sentence.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I know that it was in the context of the Committee on Devolution and Intergovernmental Relations. We have even convinced the organization that I worked for; the World Food Programme (WFP) , to distribute cash instead of relief food. It was found that if you distribute relief...

Order, Senators. Hon. Senator, please bring that to a conclusion because it has been canvassed enough. The Committee should be put in place so that they handle their matter. That brings us to the end of Statements. Next Order. CENSURE OF HON. JOHN K. MUNYES, CS FOR PETROLEUM AND MINING...

Sen. Orengo) : Thank you, Sen. Wetangula. The point of order from Sen. Cheruiyot nullifies those ones. Advising colleagues is not part of the Standing Orders either. Sen. Cherargei, I did not hear you. However, if you said somebody is holding brief, it is dangerous for this House. Sen. Kajwang’,...

Madam Deputy Speaker, two wrongs do not make a right. First, the House was enjoying the very brilliant presentation by Sen. M. Kajwang and we need to put it on record that he went to the best university in this country; Moi University, which you are also associated. That is...

That is where eloquence comes from.

Madam Deputy Speaker, I wonder where Sen. Cherargei picked his bad habit from because he also went to that university. To save this House, I want you to issue a ruling that any time somebody rises on a point of order, let them cite the relevant Standing Order that the...

Thank you, Sen. Cheruiyot. This is because of too many points of order from Sen. Cherargei. I did not hear what he said. Proceed, Sen. Wetangula.

Madam Deputy Speaker, I rise to counsel my distinguished young Senator and friend. Experience counts. Sometimes, you may think that by engaging in obstruction of debate, you are gaining some points and relevance, you are not. You brought a Statement to the House. The rules of the House say that...

A do not try to chaperone and navigate the debate towards a desired goal that you have come with. You sat in this House from yesterday including one of the most eloquent debaters on your side, the Senator for Kericho, whom I have a lot of regard for. I am...

Thank you, Sen. Wetangula. The point of order from Sen. Cheruiyot nullifies those ones. Advising colleagues is not part of the Standing Orders either. Sen. Cherargei, I did not hear you. However, if you said somebody is holding brief, it is dangerous for this House. Sen. Kajwang’, please finish up.

Madam Deputy Speaker, it would be dangerous for a Member to hold brief for a member of the Executive. The manner in which this House----

What exactly did you say?

Madam Deputy Speaker, I agree with you that it is dangerous for a Member to hold brief for a member of the Executive.

I would like to study the HANSARD later. Sen. Cherargei, you will get your right if he actually said that. Unfortunately, I did not get that. You have two minutes to finish.

Madam Deputy Speaker, the experience that we have had with the two CSs has helped us to see how this House can hold the Executive in a presidential system to account. If we continue to use the Committee of the Whole as a tool for holding the Executive to account,...

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) : Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I rise to support The Disaster Risk Management Bill that is ably sponsored by the champions of change; that is, Sen. Sakaja, ‘super Senator’ and Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. [The Deputy Speaker (Sen. (Prof.) Kamar) left the Chair] [The...

A law, under Article 153, a Cabinet Secretary (CS) can be removed for a violation of the law and if there is belief that, that person has committed a crime under international law. We have seen many cases where impeachment Motions have come before this House based on prior events...

A In Kenya, we should also try as much as possible. At the end of the day, what is governance for if it is not to make peoples’ lives better and the cost of living cheaper? At the end of the day, we should be happy when we pass legislation...

Thank you, Senator. Hon. Senators, I would like to confirm that this is not a matter affecting counties, in accordance with Article 123 (4) of the Constitution. Therefore, there will be a voice vote. (Question put and agreed to) Next Order! THE DISASTER RISK MANAGEMENT BILL (SENATE BILLS NO.14 OF...

The Senator who was on the Floor was Sen. Were. You have 17 minutes.

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I rise to support The Disaster Risk Management Bill that is ably sponsored by the champions of change; that is, Sen. Sakaja, ‘super Senator’ and Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. [The Deputy Speaker (Sen. (Prof.) Kamar) left the Chair] [The Temporary Speaker (Sen. Kinyua) in the...

A This National Disaster Risk Management Authority (NDRMA) at both the national and county level will also create public awareness campaigns, for example, some form of drills. This is so that Hon. Members are always aware that in case something like a landslide happens in the area, what is the...

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) : The Senate Minority Leader, you have a balance of 51 minutes.

September 23, 2021 SENATE DEBATES

A board clearly provided for in an Act of Parliament, you need to insert a clause here saying that we are repealing the Act of Parliament by passage of this. Otherwise, you will have a situation where you have a board that is still there with its own disaster management...

What is it Sen. Sakaja?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, Sen. Kang’ata is an advocate; I am not one. I know what we call the doctrine of implied repeal. The doctrine of implied repeal, which takes precedence in many of the laws we have done in this country, including this Parliament, is simple. An Act of...

Sen. Sakaja, are you trying to question that the Speaker does not know that? Sen. Kang’ata, proceed.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, anyway, I think the point I was trying to bring into focus is that the drafters just took into account the idea of creating several parastatals; to the extent, if at all, there are two ways to look at it. Assuming what my colleague is saying...

A I beg to support, but with those few ideas.

Thank you, Sen. Kang’ata. Sen. Orengo, proceed. The Senate Minority Leader ( Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) : Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, thank you very much. First, congratulations for sitting on that Chair. I should be speaking in Kiswahili. You are one of the people who demonstrate that for a...

A see the confusion that was taking place there. Even within the security agencies, they would not even determine whether it is the Army that should be in control, the police or General Service Unit (GSU)? There was all that confusion, even how to deal with the media. Some horrific...

The Senate Minority Leader, you have a balance of 51 minutes. ADJOURNMENT

Hon. Senators, it is now 6.30 p.m., time to adjourn the House. The Senate, therefore, stands adjourned until Tuesday 28th September, 2021, at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m.

Sen. Orengo) : There is a point of order from Sen. Orengo. On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker.

Sen. Orengo): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise pursuant to Standing Order No.32 which states clearly that the Senate may at any time for reasons stated, seek leave to move that the Senate do adjourn now to be able to discuss this matter in detail. I sat here in the morning...

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise pursuant to Standing Order No.32 which states clearly that the Senate may at any time for reasons stated, seek leave to move that the Senate do adjourn now to be able to discuss this matter in detail. I sat here in the morning and I...

Sen. Orengo) : Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I know that this is not the most ideal way of dealing with this issue. I understand the wisdom and the need to have this censure Motion, but remember that you directed that these CSs appear. On top of expressing concerns, which...

I have heard a lot of what people have said. For example, the Senator for Nandi talked about the price of fuel in other jurisdictions. That is very important material that we should put before the House when we have a debate on this matter. People have noticed. We should...

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) :decisions. Sometimes you do not listen and then wake up and say something that has already been said by somebody else. Let us try to observe our rules.We want to conclude. As I gave direction, tomorrow, we will have all the time to discuss it....

Sen. Orengo) :

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) : Madam Deputy Speaker, this matter is very sensitive but the issues of summons are clear in our Standing Orders. I support the position given by Sen. Sakaja. You should give directive to the Cabinet Secretary to appear before the Committee. The Senate Minority Leader...

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) :The next Statement is pursuant to Standing order 52(1). The Senate Majority Leader to issue a Statement on the business of the Senate for the week commencing Tuesday 21st September, 2021. Proceed Deputy Majority Leader. September 16, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 44

Sen. Orengo) : Next Order. Second Reading Madam Temporary Speaker, I can hear what Sen. Cherargei is saying. He has come here with a hatchet. I think to be realistic, during the day I was not quite satisfied that we are all reading from the same script on the question...

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) :(Bill deferred)Is Sen. Murkomen in the House? He was around but I do not see him so we defer that one also.

Sen. Orengo) : What is it, Sen. Orengo? On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir.

What is it, Sen. Orengo?

Sen. Orengo) :Proceed, August 5, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 11

I would have thought that Sen. Murkomen would remind the House the position he took when this House was discussing the Security Laws (Amendment) Bill. The position he took is what is making it possible for the police to do the kind of things that are being done now.You will...

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) : Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for also giving me this chance. Let me start by expressing sympathy and condoling with the families who through this police brutality lost their members. Secondly, what Sen. Ndwiga has said on requesting for an overhaul of the police...

What is your point of order, Sen. Orengo? The Senate Minority Leader ( Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Wambua.

Sen. Orengo):must thank the Office of the Clerk for facilitating us and the office of the Serjeant-at-Arms for ensuring these good people are in good health.Thank you. I support. Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I support the Motion. I want to thank the Senate generally for the good work we...

second in command in that Council is the Vice President. I do not sit there and neither do our principals. If something happens to the Vice President anywhere, the best place for him to bring it up is at the National Security Council. Matiang’i cannot act in the absence of...

We should have politicians who do not live a lie. You cannot be in the United Democratic Alliance (UDA) during the day and at night you claim you are in Jubilee, or you are in UDA in the evening and in the morning you claim you are in Jubilee.I am...

You forgot that Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. also does not have an English name. (Question proposed) Sen. Olekina, proceed. The two who do not have English names will be ones to speak first.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I rise to support the Motion for the adjournment of the Senate for a short recess. As Senators, we do our job. I am quite pleased that our Committees have been working. During this Session, we, as Senators, have raised very fundamental issues that need...

planners of this conference to think about having it virtually. Having a conference in Makueni County where you bring in over 1,000 people – some vaccinated and others not

Sen. Olekina, you did a Statement on this and it is referred to a particular Committee, so if you debate it, there will be nothing to submit before the Committee. Kindly conclude.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, I am guided. I just thought that because it is an adjournment Motion, I can reiterate the issues that I raised. To summarize, I beseech the Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations to expeditiously move to summon the CS and even call the...

Please be brief. It is getting late.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I support this Motion of Adjournment. Kenyans must know that we are here to serve them. We have a duty, a call and are obligated by the fact that we are Senators and so we represent counties and their interests. The recess period will be...

We talk about issues of disability because we want to make sure that we are a mainstream society. We should ensure that persons with disabilities are scaled up in the economy so that they are brought on board in terms of policy legislation and leadership.We are a serious team that...

Madam Temporary Speaker, I will brief. The recess is well deserved. Unknown to many of us, the Senate staff, for example, sergeant-at-arms and clerk assistants are going through a lot to serve us every other day although a lot of our work is done online. So, it is a good...

must thank the Office of the Clerk for facilitating us and the office of the Serjeant-at-Arms for ensuring these good people are in good health.Thank you. I support. ADJOURNMENT

Hon. Senators, having concluded the business in the Order Paper, it is now time to adjourn the Senate. The Senate therefore stands adjourned until Tuesday, 7th September, 2021 at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 8.23 p.m. August 5, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 68

Sen. Orengo): On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker.

Sen. Orengo): Thank you, Senator. Sen. Faki, proceed. Madam Temporary Speaker, I was looking at the Forest Act and it sets out the conditions under which the Cabinet Secretary (CS) can gazette a particular area as a forest. It is not a unilateral decision like the Senator for Bungoma has...

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) :“The office of the county printer shall be responsible for the printing and publication of the county gazette and shall – July 28, 2021 SENATE DEBATES 17

“The office of the county printer shall be responsible for the printing and publication of the county gazette and shall –

Sen. Orengo) : Let us have Sen. Wambua. I allowed additional comments, so that the Chairpersons can respond properly. Let us have Sen. Wambua and then Sen. Wetangula. On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. This directive was given by the Speaker. It was not given by the Chairs...

Let us have Sen. Wambua. I allowed additional comments, so that the Chairpersons can respond properly. Let us have Sen. Wambua and then Sen. Wetangula.

Madam Deputy Speaker, I will speak to two issues. One, the attempt by Sen. Farhiya to give an excuse as to why the committees did not visit. We have said this many times – a time has come that the Speaker must defend the dignity of that Chair, that, once...

Proceed, Sen. Wetangula.

Sen. Orengo): Sen. Orengo):transport the Senators because the flights to Kisumu operate more than three times a day. Further, Kenya Airways allows us to travel and then pay later. Therefore, that should not be used as an excuse.I therefore urge the two chairpersons of the responsible committees to move with...

Hon. Senators, I have listened to the ventilations that have come across. In the last sitting of the Senate, the Speaker ruled that the meeting should be held on Monday, 18th July, 2021. When a ruling has been given by the Speaker, no one has the authority to change it....

Sen. Orengothought he would say; can she increase the volume and even after the dear lady increased her volume, he is not talking, he is just doing this---(Laughter) Sen. Orengo What is your point of order, Sen. Murkomen? (Laughter)

Sen. Orengo) : Sen. Orengo) :wordings of the National Anthem and what it says and means both in Kiswahili and English.Therefore, this Bill is talking about who we are. You see a national flag outside the country, you feel a sense of belonging to this place called Kenya. We hear...