Jeremiah Omboko Milemba

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)Mover, Hon. Makali Mulu.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Rindikiri.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, we proceed with the Third Reading. THE PARLIAMENTARY PENSIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL 1st July 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 47

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Rindikiri, that is the English version of your name.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. (Question proposed) The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Makali Mulu, I was going to put the final Question. You nearly missed the opportunity to appreciate Members and other stakeholders on this Bill. You have had a long journey with it. Please,...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Makali, it has indeed been a heavy task. You travelled through a long journey. I am sure you inherited the Bill from the Governor some time ago. Having been a religious follower of the House, I can confidently confirm this to the House....

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Irene Mayaka loves sports. I am sure she has been watching all the World Cup matches. Please, proceed.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Next order. 1st July 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 49 The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)Second Reading THE PARLIAMENTARY POWERS AND PRIVILEGES (AMENDMENT) BILL

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Wanyama.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Did I see interest from Hon. Makali Mulu?

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. There being no further interest in this particular Bill, I call upon the Mover to reply.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)(Motion deferred)Hon. Members, the Leader of Delegation is one of the Members attending a meeting in Room 9. Therefore, we defer this Motion to the next session. Next Order. ADOPTION OF 2ND REPORT ON STATUS OF REPORTS ON PETITIONS AND RESOLUTIONS OF THE HOUSE The...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)Mover, Hon. Makali Mulu.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Rindikiri.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, we proceed with the Third Reading. THE PARLIAMENTARY PENSIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL 1st July 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 47

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Rindikiri, that is the English version of your name.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. (Question proposed) The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Makali Mulu, I was going to put the final Question. You nearly missed the opportunity to appreciate Members and other stakeholders on this Bill. You have had a long journey with it. Please,...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Makali, it has indeed been a heavy task. You travelled through a long journey. I am sure you inherited the Bill from the Governor some time ago. Having been a religious follower of the House, I can confidently confirm this to the House....

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Irene Mayaka loves sports. I am sure she has been watching all the World Cup matches. Please, proceed.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Next order. 1st July 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 49 The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)Second Reading THE PARLIAMENTARY POWERS AND PRIVILEGES (AMENDMENT) BILL

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Wanyama.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Did I see interest from Hon. Makali Mulu?

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. There being no further interest in this particular Bill, I call upon the Mover to reply.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)(Motion deferred)Hon. Members, the Leader of Delegation is one of the Members attending a meeting in Room 9. Therefore, we defer this Motion to the next session. Next Order. ADOPTION OF 2ND REPORT ON STATUS OF REPORTS ON PETITIONS AND RESOLUTIONS OF THE HOUSE The...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. As Hon. Baya comes to second, the Chairman, Budget and Appropriations Committee, you must know that county governments are in the Constitution and we are rightfully doing what ought to be done. Therefore, the tone and the mood must be constitutional. Proceed, Hon....

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, Hon. Owen Baya.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) No. Let me propose the Question first. (Question proposed) The Leader of the Majority Party will have the first bite.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie, you are on record. Do you want to speak to this? Proceed.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. The interest is overwhelming but those speaking, make it short. Secondly, Hon. Millie, I thought you would rise on Standing Order 87 (4) , which provides that we should not discuss other Members without a substantive Motion. However, you have already spoken...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Oundo. Hon. (Dr) Ojiambo Oundo (Funyula, ODM) . Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Allow me also to support the Motion of the mediated version of the Division of Revenue Bill (National Assembly Bill No.2 of 2026) presented by the Hon. Co-Chairman of the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Ranking Member. Father of the House, Hon. Adan Keynan, let us hear from you on this.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Bowen.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Bisau Kakai.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)The Hon. Woman Representative

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have Hon. Kombe.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Waluke.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Beatrice Elachi.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Japheth Nyakundi. I know Hon. Timothy, you were far ahead, but you stepped out, and I could not see you. Proceed, Hon. Nyakundi. 10th June 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 53

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Omanyo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, a Member rose in his place under Standing Order 95 (1) and proceeded to propose that the Mover be called upon to reply. (Question, that the Mover be now called upon to reply, put and agreed to) The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, you know our Standing Orders very well. (Question put and agreed to) Hon. Members, we may be upstanding, given the important activity that we have tomorrow. ADJOURNMENT The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, the time being 10th June 2026 NATIONAL...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) On a point of order, Hon. Speaker. Hon. Speaker Hon. Milemba, what is out of order? Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) The Honourable Member, who is also the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Education, is very aware that he is the one who presided...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) On a point of order, Hon. Speaker. Hon. Speaker Hon. Milemba, what is out of order? Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) The Honourable Member, who is also the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Education, is very aware that he is the one who presided...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) On a point of order, Hon. Speaker. Hon. Speaker Yes, Hon. Milemba. Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Speaker, this is not frivolous! The Hon. Member who has stood on that point of order had the opportunity, together with me, to be sponsored by Parliament...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) On a point of order, Hon. Speaker. Hon. Speaker Yes, Hon. Milemba. Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Speaker, this is not frivolous! The Hon. Member who has stood on that point of order had the opportunity, together with me, to be sponsored by Parliament...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) The Chairlady, proceed to report.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) The Chairlady, proceed to report.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal. 2nd June 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 39

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal. 2nd June 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 39

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Zamzam.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Zamzam.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Okay. We need to wind up. We did the Second Reading. Let us hear Hon. Millie. 2nd June 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 40

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Okay. We need to wind up. We did the Second Reading. Let us hear Hon. Millie. 2nd June 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 40

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Finally, Hon. Oundo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Finally, Hon. Oundo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) What is your point of order, Hon. Baya? I think the Speaker has just told us about this.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) What is your point of order, Hon. Baya? I think the Speaker has just told us about this.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. I still allowed you to have that point of order because it was just demonstrating very clearly what the Speaker talked about earlier on—misadventure. Hon. Orero, you have one minute. Hon. Members, this is not the Second Reading. It is the Third...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. I still allowed you to have that point of order because it was just demonstrating very clearly what the Speaker talked about earlier on—misadventure. Hon. Orero, you have one minute. Hon. Members, this is not the Second Reading. It is the Third...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) You have done well towards the end. This is not the Second Reading and so, let us not go into the very fine details. What Hon. Millie did was a very good example of what it should be. Let us hear Hon. Joshua Kimilu.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) You have done well towards the end. This is not the Second Reading and so, let us not go into the very fine details. What Hon. Millie did was a very good example of what it should be. Let us hear Hon. Joshua Kimilu.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Kimilu. Hon. Millie is a very seasoned legislator. If you have to refer to her, you will need a substantive Motion. Quickly proceed and withdraw those remarks.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Kimilu. Hon. Millie is a very seasoned legislator. If you have to refer to her, you will need a substantive Motion. Quickly proceed and withdraw those remarks.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, thank you. We have heard the good side of it. I now proceed to put the question. (Question put and agreed to) (The Bill was accordingly read a Third Time and passed) Next Order. THE KENYA JUDICIARY ACADEMY BILL The Temporary Speaker...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, thank you. We have heard the good side of it. I now proceed to put the question. (Question put and agreed to) (The Bill was accordingly read a Third Time and passed) Next Order. THE KENYA JUDICIARY ACADEMY BILL The Temporary Speaker...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed to second, Hon. Member. When you are seconding, you cannot be on a point of order. I do not know which one you will take. I propose that you second the Bill.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed to second, Hon. Member. When you are seconding, you cannot be on a point of order. I do not know which one you will take. I propose that you second the Bill.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order. Give him the microphone.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order. Give him the microphone.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed to second.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed to second.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well, Hon. Members. (Question proposed) The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, I would like to give some directions before we go into the main debate. Unfortunately, I can see the Chairman of the Budget and Appropriations Committee is busy with other...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well, Hon. Members. (Question proposed) The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, I would like to give some directions before we go into the main debate. Unfortunately, I can see the Chairman of the Budget and Appropriations Committee is busy with other...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Mutuse, you will have your final bite on this.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Mutuse, you will have your final bite on this.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let Hon. Mutuse finish his bit. You will have a chance to speak to the Bill. I can see your name is on the list. Hon. Mutuse, you may proceed to finish your contribution.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let Hon. Mutuse finish his bit. You will have a chance to speak to the Bill. I can see your name is on the list. Hon. Mutuse, you may proceed to finish your contribution.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie will be next to speak on this. Before that and as earlier directed by the Hon. Speaker, allow me to direct that we go back to Order No. 5 and Order No. 6 to allow the Chairman of the Budget and Appropriations...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie will be next to speak on this. Before that and as earlier directed by the Hon. Speaker, allow me to direct that we go back to Order No. 5 and Order No. 6 to allow the Chairman of the Budget and Appropriations...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) You may proceed to lay. The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Deputy Leader of the Majority Party, what is it?

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) You may proceed to lay. The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Deputy Leader of the Majority Party, what is it?

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Deputy Leader of the Majority Party. We have already heard from you. Order. Allow me to give direction. We heard you very clearly when you moved it. We have heard Hon. Mutuse’s argument, and I have allowed two points of order. Allow the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Deputy Leader of the Majority Party. We have already heard from you. Order. Allow me to give direction. We heard you very clearly when you moved it. We have heard Hon. Mutuse’s argument, and I have allowed two points of order. Allow the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Yes, Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Yes, Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Wilberforce Oundo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Wilberforce Oundo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, allow debate to flow because all of you will have a chance to speak to this. I followed the arguments by Hon. Julius, Hon. Millie and Hon. Mutuse. When you give examples, you must put them at the level of the Constitution...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, allow debate to flow because all of you will have a chance to speak to this. I followed the arguments by Hon. Julius, Hon. Millie and Hon. Mutuse. When you give examples, you must put them at the level of the Constitution...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Before I give Hon. Caroli Omondi a chance, what you are debating is very relevant to some of the constitutional clauses within our Constitution, which have sometimes become hiccups. When you look at the Article quoted by Hon. Sunkuli, it is quite...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Before I give Hon. Caroli Omondi a chance, what you are debating is very relevant to some of the constitutional clauses within our Constitution, which have sometimes become hiccups. When you look at the Article quoted by Hon. Sunkuli, it is quite...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us hear Hon. Timothy Toroitich.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us hear Hon. Timothy Toroitich.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) I expected Hon. Mutuse to be on a point of order. He did not. Anyway, let us proceed. For those who are following keenly, let us hear from wakili Hon. Stephen Mogaka.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) I expected Hon. Mutuse to be on a point of order. He did not. Anyway, let us proceed. For those who are following keenly, let us hear from wakili Hon. Stephen Mogaka.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. If Members pass this Bill, they will give teachers an opportunity to make a similar law. However, we have to deal with the issues of constitutionality that you spoke about. I also expected Hon. Mutuse to rise on a point of order...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. If Members pass this Bill, they will give teachers an opportunity to make a similar law. However, we have to deal with the issues of constitutionality that you spoke about. I also expected Hon. Mutuse to rise on a point of order...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) On a point of order, Hon. Speaker. Hon. Speaker Hon. Milemba, what is out of order? Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) The Honourable Member, who is also the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Education, is very aware that he is the one who presided...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) On a point of order, Hon. Speaker. Hon. Speaker Yes, Hon. Milemba. Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Speaker, this is not frivolous! The Hon. Member who has stood on that point of order had the opportunity, together with me, to be sponsored by Parliament...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) The Chairlady, proceed to report.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal. 2nd June 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 39

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Zamzam.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Okay. We need to wind up. We did the Second Reading. Let us hear Hon. Millie. 2nd June 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 40

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Finally, Hon. Oundo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) What is your point of order, Hon. Baya? I think the Speaker has just told us about this.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. I still allowed you to have that point of order because it was just demonstrating very clearly what the Speaker talked about earlier on—misadventure. Hon. Orero, you have one minute. Hon. Members, this is not the Second Reading. It is the Third...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) You have done well towards the end. This is not the Second Reading and so, let us not go into the very fine details. What Hon. Millie did was a very good example of what it should be. Let us hear Hon. Joshua Kimilu.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Kimilu. Hon. Millie is a very seasoned legislator. If you have to refer to her, you will need a substantive Motion. Quickly proceed and withdraw those remarks.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, thank you. We have heard the good side of it. I now proceed to put the question. (Question put and agreed to) (The Bill was accordingly read a Third Time and passed) Next Order. THE KENYA JUDICIARY ACADEMY BILL The Temporary Speaker...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed to second, Hon. Member. When you are seconding, you cannot be on a point of order. I do not know which one you will take. I propose that you second the Bill.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order. Give him the microphone.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed to second.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well, Hon. Members. (Question proposed) The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, I would like to give some directions before we go into the main debate. Unfortunately, I can see the Chairman of the Budget and Appropriations Committee is busy with other...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Mutuse, you will have your final bite on this.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let Hon. Mutuse finish his bit. You will have a chance to speak to the Bill. I can see your name is on the list. Hon. Mutuse, you may proceed to finish your contribution.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie will be next to speak on this. Before that and as earlier directed by the Hon. Speaker, allow me to direct that we go back to Order No. 5 and Order No. 6 to allow the Chairman of the Budget and Appropriations...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) You may proceed to lay. The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Deputy Leader of the Majority Party, what is it?

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Deputy Leader of the Majority Party. We have already heard from you. Order. Allow me to give direction. We heard you very clearly when you moved it. We have heard Hon. Mutuse’s argument, and I have allowed two points of order. Allow the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Yes, Hon. Mutuse.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Wilberforce Oundo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, allow debate to flow because all of you will have a chance to speak to this. I followed the arguments by Hon. Julius, Hon. Millie and Hon. Mutuse. When you give examples, you must put them at the level of the Constitution...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Before I give Hon. Caroli Omondi a chance, what you are debating is very relevant to some of the constitutional clauses within our Constitution, which have sometimes become hiccups. When you look at the Article quoted by Hon. Sunkuli, it is quite...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us hear Hon. Timothy Toroitich.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) I expected Hon. Mutuse to be on a point of order. He did not. Anyway, let us proceed. For those who are following keenly, let us hear from wakili Hon. Stephen Mogaka.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. If Members pass this Bill, they will give teachers an opportunity to make a similar law. However, we have to deal with the issues of constitutionality that you spoke about. I also expected Hon. Mutuse to rise on a point of order...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Speaker, thank you for this chance. As we welcome Hon. Wanyonyi back, it opens up discussion within the labour sector on the need to have people who assist those who may not have speech or other abilities required to effectively execute their work. We...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Speaker, thank you for this chance. As we welcome Hon. Wanyonyi back, it opens up discussion within the labour sector on the need to have people who assist those who may not have speech or other abilities required to effectively execute their work. We...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well, Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs. Before I bring Hon. Mwenje, who is very ready to deal with this matter… (Hon. Mark Mwenje spoke off the record) I will be bringing you. Before then, let us acknowledge the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well, Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs. Before I bring Hon. Mwenje, who is very ready to deal with this matter… (Hon. Mark Mwenje spoke off the record) I will be bringing you. Before then, let us acknowledge the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Are you on a point of order, Hon. Millie? (Hon. Millie Odhiambo-Mabona spoke off the record) Let us listen to the Member for Emgwen.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Are you on a point of order, Hon. Millie? (Hon. Millie Odhiambo-Mabona spoke off the record) Let us listen to the Member for Emgwen.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Hon. Cherorot.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Hon. Cherorot.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. You need to be much briefer than that because these are just comments. Let us give Hon. Millie a chance, very briefly.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. You need to be much briefer than that because these are just comments. Let us give Hon. Millie a chance, very briefly.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. I think that is done. We have had enough of that. Let us go to business, Members. Let us get the first bite from Hon. Mwenje.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. I think that is done. We have had enough of that. Let us go to business, Members. Let us get the first bite from Hon. Mwenje.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, proceed. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 29

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, proceed. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 29

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) I can see some interest. Let me just take two. Hon. Oundo, be brief. The first speaker had the leverage.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) I can see some interest. Let me just take two. Hon. Oundo, be brief. The first speaker had the leverage.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) No, just bring a Question; it cannot be killed. The business here must be undertaken. I can see Hon. Wandeto. Very briefly, and then we go back to the Chairperson. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 30

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) No, just bring a Question; it cannot be killed. The business here must be undertaken. I can see Hon. Wandeto. Very briefly, and then we go back to the Chairperson. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 30

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Chairperson. Order.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Chairperson. Order.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Thank you, Chairperson. Your strength in that area has been the specifics, because this is a House of rules and order. Honourable Members, you can bring substantive questions, and they are dealt with using specifics. Hon. Mwenje did very well in terms of the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Thank you, Chairperson. Your strength in that area has been the specifics, because this is a House of rules and order. Honourable Members, you can bring substantive questions, and they are dealt with using specifics. Hon. Mwenje did very well in terms of the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Check on the people who need to come to the House. We have our Standing Orders, which guide us on who can be called here. Let us move to the next business. Is Hon. Martin Pepela in the House? If so, do we have...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Check on the people who need to come to the House. We have our Standing Orders, which guide us on who can be called here. Let us move to the next business. Is Hon. Martin Pepela in the House? If so, do we have...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Proceed, Hon. Chairman. Is Hon. Ahmed Hassan in the House? He is not in. I would have asked you to proceed with the second response, since they are on the same subject. Let us have Hon. Pepela.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Proceed, Hon. Chairman. Is Hon. Ahmed Hassan in the House? He is not in. I would have asked you to proceed with the second response, since they are on the same subject. Let us have Hon. Pepela.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Member. You are digressing. We dealt with this matter when the substantive Speaker was here. You have an opportunity to table a Special Motion next week, specifically to deal with that matter. I will support you as a teacher. So, please, confine...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Member. You are digressing. We dealt with this matter when the substantive Speaker was here. You have an opportunity to table a Special Motion next week, specifically to deal with that matter. I will support you as a teacher. So, please, confine...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Is the Leader of the Majority Party in the House for his Statement? Maybe we shall still give him a chance to give the Thursday Statement when he comes in. (Hon. Kimani Ichung’wah entered the Chamber) Here he is walking in. He...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Is the Leader of the Majority Party in the House for his Statement? Maybe we shall still give him a chance to give the Thursday Statement when he comes in. (Hon. Kimani Ichung’wah entered the Chamber) Here he is walking in. He...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Leader of the Majority Party, just one minute as you settle down. Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure, you can bring the answers you had to the Clerks-at-the-Table because the Member of Banissa is not in the House. We can...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Leader of the Majority Party, just one minute as you settle down. Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure, you can bring the answers you had to the Clerks-at-the-Table because the Member of Banissa is not in the House. We can...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Next Order. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 35 THE MICROFINANCE BILL THE KENYA REVENUE AUTHORITY (AMENDMENT) BILL The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Next Order by the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Defence, Intelligence and Foreign Relations.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Next Order. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 35 THE MICROFINANCE BILL THE KENYA REVENUE AUTHORITY (AMENDMENT) BILL The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Next Order by the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Defence, Intelligence and Foreign Relations.

Hon. Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie, both you and the Chair have spoken on the rescheduling of the nominee's appearance. That is a matter you may escalate to the Speaker, as all these processes are carried out in accordance with the Standing Orders, the Constitution, and the laws...

Hon. Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie, both you and the Chair have spoken on the rescheduling of the nominee's appearance. That is a matter you may escalate to the Speaker, as all these processes are carried out in accordance with the Standing Orders, the Constitution, and the laws...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. We shall proceed. That is banter and canter we allow in Parliament at any time. (Hon. Ndindi Nyoro spoke off the record) Hon. Ndindi, I had added you one minute, and you did well. Let us hear Hon. (Dr) Oundo, who has...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. We shall proceed. That is banter and canter we allow in Parliament at any time. (Hon. Ndindi Nyoro spoke off the record) Hon. Ndindi, I had added you one minute, and you did well. Let us hear Hon. (Dr) Oundo, who has...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. (Dr) Oundo. The Leader of the Majority Party has a point of order. (Laughter)

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. (Dr) Oundo. The Leader of the Majority Party has a point of order. (Laughter)

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Oundo, before you pick up from where you left, allow me to acknowledge the presence of students from Githunguri Girls High School in Kandara Constituency, Murang’a County, who are seated in the Public Gallery. On behalf of the House, I welcome the students...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Oundo, before you pick up from where you left, allow me to acknowledge the presence of students from Githunguri Girls High School in Kandara Constituency, Murang’a County, who are seated in the Public Gallery. On behalf of the House, I welcome the students...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Gathoni Wamuchomba.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Gathoni Wamuchomba.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Robert Basil.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Robert Basil.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. John Gitonga.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. John Gitonga.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Gitonga, there is a point of information from the Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Gitonga, there is a point of information from the Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. (Question put and agreed to) Next Order. THE PUBLIC FINANCE MANAGEMENT (AMENDMENT) BILL The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. (Question put and agreed to) Next Order. THE PUBLIC FINANCE MANAGEMENT (AMENDMENT) BILL The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Millie and the Leader of the Majority Party. Proceed procedurally. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 47

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Millie and the Leader of the Majority Party. Proceed procedurally. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 47

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Ndindi Nyoro.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Ndindi Nyoro.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie Odhiambo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie Odhiambo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. Hon. Millie, you may proceed.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. Hon. Millie, you may proceed.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. John Gitonga.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. John Gitonga.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) One more Member wants to contribute. Let us see if we can get him. Hon. Basil, you have a few minutes. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 54

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) One more Member wants to contribute. Let us see if we can get him. Hon. Basil, you have a few minutes. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 54

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have the Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have the Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. I thank Members for the good quality debate, the candour and banter involved. You have made me happy. Hon. Members, we shall put the question at the next sitting. (Putting the question deferred) 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 55 ADJOURNMENT The...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. I thank Members for the good quality debate, the candour and banter involved. You have made me happy. Hon. Members, we shall put the question at the next sitting. (Putting the question deferred) 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 55 ADJOURNMENT The...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Speaker, thank you for this chance. As we welcome Hon. Wanyonyi back, it opens up discussion within the labour sector on the need to have people who assist those who may not have speech or other abilities required to effectively execute their work. We...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well, Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs. Before I bring Hon. Mwenje, who is very ready to deal with this matter… (Hon. Mark Mwenje spoke off the record) I will be bringing you. Before then, let us acknowledge the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Are you on a point of order, Hon. Millie? (Hon. Millie Odhiambo-Mabona spoke off the record) Let us listen to the Member for Emgwen.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Hon. Cherorot.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. You need to be much briefer than that because these are just comments. Let us give Hon. Millie a chance, very briefly.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. I think that is done. We have had enough of that. Let us go to business, Members. Let us get the first bite from Hon. Mwenje.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, proceed. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 29

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) I can see some interest. Let me just take two. Hon. Oundo, be brief. The first speaker had the leverage.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) No, just bring a Question; it cannot be killed. The business here must be undertaken. I can see Hon. Wandeto. Very briefly, and then we go back to the Chairperson. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 30

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Chairperson. Order.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Thank you, Chairperson. Your strength in that area has been the specifics, because this is a House of rules and order. Honourable Members, you can bring substantive questions, and they are dealt with using specifics. Hon. Mwenje did very well in terms of the...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Check on the people who need to come to the House. We have our Standing Orders, which guide us on who can be called here. Let us move to the next business. Is Hon. Martin Pepela in the House? If so, do we have...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Proceed, Hon. Chairman. Is Hon. Ahmed Hassan in the House? He is not in. I would have asked you to proceed with the second response, since they are on the same subject. Let us have Hon. Pepela.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Member. You are digressing. We dealt with this matter when the substantive Speaker was here. You have an opportunity to table a Special Motion next week, specifically to deal with that matter. I will support you as a teacher. So, please, confine...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Is the Leader of the Majority Party in the House for his Statement? Maybe we shall still give him a chance to give the Thursday Statement when he comes in. (Hon. Kimani Ichung’wah entered the Chamber) Here he is walking in. He...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Leader of the Majority Party, just one minute as you settle down. Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure, you can bring the answers you had to the Clerks-at-the-Table because the Member of Banissa is not in the House. We can...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Next Order. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 35 THE MICROFINANCE BILL THE KENYA REVENUE AUTHORITY (AMENDMENT) BILL The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Next Order by the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Defence, Intelligence and Foreign Relations.

Hon. Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie, both you and the Chair have spoken on the rescheduling of the nominee's appearance. That is a matter you may escalate to the Speaker, as all these processes are carried out in accordance with the Standing Orders, the Constitution, and the laws...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. We shall proceed. That is banter and canter we allow in Parliament at any time. (Hon. Ndindi Nyoro spoke off the record) Hon. Ndindi, I had added you one minute, and you did well. Let us hear Hon. (Dr) Oundo, who has...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. (Dr) Oundo. The Leader of the Majority Party has a point of order. (Laughter)

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Oundo, before you pick up from where you left, allow me to acknowledge the presence of students from Githunguri Girls High School in Kandara Constituency, Murang’a County, who are seated in the Public Gallery. On behalf of the House, I welcome the students...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Gathoni Wamuchomba.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Robert Basil.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. John Gitonga.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Gitonga, there is a point of information from the Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. (Question put and agreed to) Next Order. THE PUBLIC FINANCE MANAGEMENT (AMENDMENT) BILL The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Order, Hon. Millie and the Leader of the Majority Party. Proceed procedurally. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 47

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Ndindi Nyoro.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Millie Odhiambo.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. Hon. Millie, you may proceed.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Proceed, Leader of the Majority Party.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. John Gitonga.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) One more Member wants to contribute. Let us see if we can get him. Hon. Basil, you have a few minutes. 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 54

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have the Mover.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. I thank Members for the good quality debate, the candour and banter involved. You have made me happy. Hon. Members, we shall put the question at the next sitting. (Putting the question deferred) 28th May 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 55 ADJOURNMENT The...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Thank you very much, Hon. Deputy Speaker. [The Deputy Speaker (Hon. Gladys Boss) left the Chair] [The Temporary Speaker (Hon. David Ochieng’) in the Chair] The Question had already been undertaken and discussed in this House. It thereafter, ensued over the matter related to payment...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Temporary Speaker, we cannot reduce this House to only oversee. I, therefore, I agree with the Mover on this matter, that the fourth sustainable development goal was about access to education and that is prime. So, if school uniform is hindering access, then we...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Temporary Speaker, that was a request for a Statement from me that coalesced to become what it is now. However, that notwithstanding, the Cabinet Secretary is not telling the House when they will pay the examiners. He has told the House how much they...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Let me speak to this. What does the Cabinet Secretary mean by the word ‘negotiating’? Exams were done and the teachers and supervisors marked them. The Ministry is negotiating with the National Treasury to see whether it can pay or not. That is not a...

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Hon. Temporary Speaker, I plead with you that 14 days is too far. Like we had resolved earlier, this Parliament urges the Executive to use Article 223 to pay teachers in the next three to five days. 22nd April 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 31

Hon. Omboko Milemba (Emuhaya, ANC) Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I would wish to support Hon. Mishi. What is the Ministry doing, in collaboration with the Teachers Service Commission (TSC) , on the issue of staffing? The Ministry should manage and work with TSC on this matter. That working formula...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)Great. Hon. Osero Kibagendi.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Members, I remember this was a very stormy matter, being a very regular person in Parliament. Let us have the first bite from Hon. Moses Kirima. Where is the Member who seconded this Motion? He did not go on record as seconding it....

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. Having done that, we can now hear Hon. Moses Kirima.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Please give him one more minute. He sounds quite knowledgeable in this area. 22nd April 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 55

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Great. Let us now hear from Hon. John Gitonga.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Indeed, Members, you will notice that when this matter came to the Floor of the House, there was almost an uproar. There was suspicion, and farmers felt the administration had changed. Indeed, this report then becomes very crucial. Therefore, let it be adjourned to...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Hon. Kirima.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. (Hon. Dorothy Muthoni spoke off the record) Let me propose the question first. (Question proposed) We can now hear from you, Hon. Dorothy Ikiara.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Let us have Hon. Kirima.

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. (Question, that debate be now adjourned, put and agreed to) (Debate on the Motion adjourned) Next Order. ADOPTION OF REPORT ON ACCESS TO HEALTHCARE BY CANCER PATIENTS 22nd April 2026 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY DEBATES 59 The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba)to healthcare by...

The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. Serjeant-at-Arms, ring the Quorum Bell for 10 minutes. (The Quorum Bell was rung) The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Omboko Milemba) Very well. We have done the 10 minutes and we can stop there. A Member rose from his place under Standing Order 35...