Tuesday 4th October, 2016

Order, Senators! Hon. Senators, I have a short communication to make.

Hon. Senators, it is my pleasure to welcome you back from the long recess on this first day of the last part of this current Session which, as you are all aware, ends in December this year. Despite the numerous interruptions caused by Special Sittings, it is my sincere hope that you all had a pleasant recess.

Before we went on recess, the Senate conducted a substantial amount of business in line with its mandate as provided in the Constitution. Just to refresh your memories, some of the business transacted during the previous part of this session and during the Special Sitting was as follows:-

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I thank you for the communiqué. I note that in your communication you have referred to the peaceful rest we had during the vacation---

I did not mention the word peaceful in my communication. That is your own word.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I will paraphrase. You mentioned that we enjoyed the recess. Allow me to point out especially to the listening public that we, as FORD-Kenya did not find it enjoyable. We lost Ahmed Salim Bamahriz, the founder of FORD-Kenya. He died in a hospital in the United Arab Emirates (UAE) due to diabetes. The party leader of FORD-Kenya has already communicated to the country. I want to use this opportunity to send my condolences to the family and especially the families of his colleagues in the second liberation.

Young Kenyans will not know that Bamahriz was detained in this country in the early 1960s. They will also not know that he is one of the six fathers of the second liberation that gave us multiparty democracy which we have been forced to put in the Constitution. That today, some people are thinking of one-party rule, is not an honour to Bamahriz.

Thank you.

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. I join you in sending condolences to the family of the late Bamahriz. I do not know whether you are correct in saying that he was in FORD-Kenya. However, I remember him because we were there in the original FORD. That is where I remember Ahmed Bamahriz. When you say he was among the six originators of the second liberation, I remember him very well as a young lawyer then. I am just correcting you.

Thank you very much for bringing up that issue. It is important that we should condole with then family of the late Bamahriz.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in conclusion, I was just telling the country that it was a very difficult thing. Bamahriz, Martin Shikuku, Kenneth Matiba, Jaramogi Oginga Odinga, the late Hon. Shamalla and Masinde Muliro literally used to hide---

You must put in Charles Rubia to finish the six.

Yes, and Charles Rubia, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. They literally used to hide in a private office of advocate Shamalla so as to do their meetings to help Kenya achieve multiparty democracy. I send my condolences and hope that at no time will the country ever rise to amend this Constitution so as to create a one party state the way some misguided party leaders have started showing.

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

Is it on the same issue? The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. Thank you for recognizing me. For the record, Bamahriz was among the six who founded FORD. When Hon. Kenneth Matiba and Martin Shikuku moved away, he remained with Jaramogi Oginga Odinga and Masinde Muliro to start FORD-Kenya.

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

Is it on the same issue? The Senate Minority Leader (

I cannot ascertain that one. The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I join Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale in sending my condolences to the family and friends of the late Mohammed Salim Bamahriz. For those who may have forgotten, this is the man who stood with courage and said:-

“Serikali ya mzee Moi inasema kaeni hivyo hivyo. Hata kama umekalia msumari, kaeni hivyo hivyo. Hata kama mumekalia maji, kaeni hivyo hivyo. Hata kama mumekalia moto, kaeni hivyo hivyo.”

That is what opened Kenyans’ eyes to see that one could actually criticize President Moi. This made Kenyans start thinking that there is an alternative route in the politics of this country. I am proud to tell the country that his son is a distinguished Member of the FORD-Kenya party and he is playing a very critical role in nurturing and enhancing the desire and the oath of yours truly to be your fifth President.

Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. Thank you for recognizing me. For the record, Bamahriz was among the six who founded FORD. When Hon. Kenneth Matiba and Martin Shikuku moved away, he remained with Jaramogi Oginga Odinga and Masinde Muliro to start FORD-Kenya.

Was I not right in saying that he was a founder of FORD? The Senate Minority Leader (

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I also join my colleagues in sending my condolences to the family of the late Bamahriz. When they were struggling during what

I cannot ascertain that one. The Senate Minority Leader (

they called the “second liberation”, most of us were in the Kenya African National Union (KANU). The way he used to describe the then regime in Swahili was so sweet that most of us could not even narrate what he used to say.

Just to inform you, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, apart from that, I also want to congratulate him because he was just recently elected as Deputy Leader of Sen. Wetangula.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I join Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale in sending my condolences to the family and friends of the late Mohammed Salim Bamahriz. For those who may have forgotten, this is the man who stood with courage and said:- “Serikali ya mzee Moi inasema kaeni hivyo hivyo. Hata kama umekalia msumari, kaeni hivyo hivyo. Hata kama mumekalia maji, kaeni hivyo hivyo. Hata kama mumekalia moto, kaeni hivyo hivyo.” That is what opened Kenyans’ eyes to see that one could actually criticize President Moi. This made Kenyans start thinking that there is an alternative route in the politics of this country. I am proud to tell the country that his son is a distinguished Member of the FORD-Kenya party and he is playing a very critical role in nurturing and enhancing the desire and the oath of yours truly to be your fifth President.

There are two others Members seeking the Floor. I will give them two minutes each.

Sen. (Dr.) Agnes Zani!

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I also join my colleagues in sending condolences to the late Ahmed Bamahriz’s family. We acknowledge him as a leader who actually opened up democratic space that we sometimes take for granted. Never in Kenya should some people think that only some people can speak and others cannot. However, this is the Kenya we have and it is for all of us. We should move towards harmony, listen to each other and discern. Even if somebody is speaking not from the front that you would want them to, learn to listen and understand.

In your communication, you talked about 27 Bills that are at the National Assembly that have not been processed. Hopefully when we finish this Session, we might find a way of engaging to make sure that those Bills are processed at one time or another.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I also join my colleagues in sending my condolences to the family of the late Bamahriz. When they were struggling during what

they called the “second liberation”, most of us were in the Kenya African National Union (KANU). The way he used to describe the then regime in Swahili was so sweet that most of us could not even narrate what he used to say.

Just to inform you, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, apart from that, I also want to congratulate him because he was just recently elected as Deputy Leader of Sen. Wetangula.

Bw. Naibu wa Spika, ninakushukuru kwa nafasi hii ili nami niungane na wenzangu kwa kutuma rambirambi kwa jamaa na marafiki wa marehemu Bamahriz. Huyu shujaa alifanya kazi ya ukombozi wa pili wa taifa letu ambao uliibua vyama kama The National Alliance (TNA) , United Republican Party (URP) , Jubilee na vyama vingine vyote. Ni kwa sababu ya kazi aliyofanya marehemu Bamahriz. Alikuwa shujaa.

Ninakumbuka wakati mmoja Rais Moi alisema: “Huyu Mwarabu ana lugha mbaya sana ya kusumbua watu. Ikiwezekana, anaweza kurudi kwao Yemen.” Sijui Rais Moi alijuaje kwamba marehemu Bamahriz alitoka Yemen. Hata hivyo, Marehemu Bamahriz alisema: “Mimi nataka tupande ndege moja na Rais Moi, tupitie Sudan ya Kusini, tumshushe pale na mimi niende zangu Yemen.” Kutoka siku hiyo, hakuna mtu mmoja aliyezungumzia mambo hayo.

Ni dhahiri kwamba viongozi wakiongea, tunafika pahali. Ninashangaa sasa hata waandishi wa magazeti wanasema kwamba Bamahriz ni mtu ambaye hakuogopa chochote. Enzi hizo aliposema tu chama kimoja kinakandamiza Wakenya, alisemekana analeta lugha ya chuki. Alipata tabu na kuwekwa korokoroni. Hata hivyo, mimi ninaamini kwamba hata Yesu alisulubiwa msalabani kwa sababu ya lugha ya kutomheshimu kiongozi aliyekuwa akitawala. Vile vile, Hayati Mzee Jomo Kenyatta na wenzake walienda jela sio kwa sababu ya kuiba, lakini kwa sababu ya kutetea wananchi. Tunaomba Mungu aiweke roho yake mahali pema peponi.

I do not understand how you got more than two minutes, Sen. Muthama. Somebody is not doing their work properly.

Sen. Karaba, two minutes.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I arise concerning your Statement. In today’s newspaper, it was reported that the National Assembly is doing a lot in trying to finalise Bills, only to realise that the Bill which was headlined in today’s Standard newspaper originated from this House. That is the Bill on the Kenya National Examination Council (KNEC) . So, I would like to caution the newspaper reporters that they should dig further and get to know the root of some of these Bills.

Sen. Karaba, I have no idea what you are talking about partly because it is not in my communication and second, I have not seen the newspaper that you are talking about. I know ---

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it so unfortunate ---

We do not get strength from newspaper reports unless you table it.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it can portray the image that we are not doing anything yet it is in the communication for ---

It is not in my communication. I have not referred to The Standard newspaper.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, did you not talk about Bills?

Our Bills; the ones that we have dealt with.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, that is our Bill but it was misquoted.

Sen. (Prof.) Anyang'-Nyong'o, two minutes. Sen. (Dr.) Machage will follow and then that will be it.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I think I deserve more than two minutes in this House to speak about my colleague, the late Salim Bamahriz. I know and you all know that I was a young turk. In those days, we joined together with the six elders to carry out the important task of fighting for democracy and the introduction of multi-party system in this country.

The late Bamahriz was a very charismatic man. He was one who was together with the ordinary Kenyans – the wanyonge. He showed extra ordinary courage to come out from the coast and join the late Jaramogi Oginga Odinga, Masinde Muliro, Martin Shikuku, George Nthenge, Phillip Gachoka and the six of us – the young turks – Raila Odinga, Sen. James Orengo, Dr. Mukhisa Kituyi, Paul Muite, Imanyara Mugambi and myself to start this multi-party journey.

For the record, Senator, it is Gitobu Imanyara.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, sorry. It was Hon. Gitobu Imanyara. You know, uzee umeingia.

So, we must enshrine those days in the history of this country. It should not only be when the late Bamahriz enters his last journey to heaven that this nation should remember him. I think this nation should have a tradition of celebrating men and women who have made a difference to the life of this nation.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this nation should celebrate good leaders whom I describe as men and women who make a positive difference to the lives of their people. The late Bamahriz and the leaders in the Forum for Restoration of Democracy (FORD) made a positive difference to the lives of Kenyans. We have had other leaders, yes, but they are not good leaders and do not make a positive difference to the lives of their people. As I eulogise the late Bahmariz, I want him to enter into the annals of history as one who fought bravely as a good leader and who made a positive difference to the lives of Kenyans in the fight for the second liberation and democratization in Kenya.

I salute him.

Thank you. Finally, Sen. (Dr.) Machage. Two minutes.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, those who were old enough those days know the vibrancy with which the late Salim Bamahriz approached politics. As a voiceof a minority from the coast, he could never be silenced. He spoke his mind. Some of the issues that he addressed have been addressed by the Constitution. Unfortunately, quite a few have not been addressed and especially those issues that were put forward by the first six in the creation of FORD.

It is a challenge to the current leadership. My challenge to the ruling party and the Opposition – I want one of the principals, not the “secondary school principals” but the one for the Coalition for Reforms and Democracy (CORD) to listen – as a leader of a major political party and the leadership of Uhuru, we want to hear as a minority, your position on democratic distribution of election seats in this country. We have democratic

dictatorship that is taking root in this country which must be addressed by the leadership. We want to listen to your plans on protection of the minorities of this country.

Thank you.

Sen. (Dr.) Machage, I must decry the habit because I had given leave for an extremely important situation to mourn and condole with the family of the late Salim Bamahriz. I was hoping that no political statements would be made. That is the reason I stopped Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale when he wanted to move beyond that.We all must respect the late Bamahriz whom some of us also knew was involved in the second liberation. So, I would like it to rest at that so that he can rest in peace.

Sen. (Dr.) Machage, had you finished?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as we eulogize the late Salim, let us remember what he fought for. My condolences.

Order Senators. I have another Communication to make.

This afternoon, hon. Senators, I would like to acknowledge the presence in the Speaker’s Gallery of the visiting staff from various county assemblies. The county assembly staff are here on a ten day county staff legislative attachment program at the Senate. I request each member of the delegation to stand when called out so that they may be acknowledged in the usual Senate tradition.

They are:-

Order Senators.

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, I do not know what you expect me to do. I have given two Messages from the National Assembly and I have told you what they say. I do not know what else you want me to confirm because we must deal with issues as they come and as they are.

October 4, 2016 SENATE DEBATES PAPER LAID THE SENATE MONITORING FUND REGULATIONS

October 4, 2016 SENATE DEBATES PASSAGE OF THE KENYA ROADS BILL (NATIONAL ASSEMBLY BILL NO. 26 OF 2015)

October 4, 2016 SENATE DEBATES PASSAGE OF THE WAREHOUSE RECEIPTS SYSTEM BILL (NATIONAL ASSEMBLY BILL NO.12 OF 2015)

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. It is nice to see that the Senate is applying Article 110 (4) of the Constitution to the letter. We are aware that several Bills had been taken to the National Assembly from this House. I am glad to know and notice that in respect of the two Bills that you have read to us today as well as Messages, you have ordered that they be on the Order Paper tomorrow which is immediate. Could you confirm that consultations have been going on between the Speakers of the two Houses and assure us that our Bills will receive similar treatment in the National Assembly?

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, I do not know what you expect me to do. I have given two Messages from the National Assembly and I have told you what they say. I do not know what else you want me to confirm because we must deal with issues as they come and as they are.

October 4, 2016 SENATE DEBATES PAPER LAID THE SENATE MONITORING FUND REGULATIONS

Thank you, Sen. Wetangula. Sen. Adan.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I am requesting the Senate Minority Leader and as a Member of the same Committee, to give us two weeks because this requires a bit of investigations to be done and also collecting information from various institutions that he has mentioned.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg that you indulge me to seek further clarification on this very important matter. As the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations contemplates bringing the Statement, I would have to also include two aspects. The first one is what measures the Government put in place in all our universities to ensure that our children are safe while at college, going home and coming back to college.

The second aspect is that the Senate Minority Leader has spoken to the issue of compensation of the family. Could he also come armed with an answer on the state of compensation to the family of the student who was similarly kidnapped and found murdered in the same manner by the name of Solomon Muruli from Shinyalu---

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, I am not stopping you but I want you to appreciate one thing. Sen. Wetangula has sought a specific Statement on a specific person. The danger is that if we now bring a general situation and another student, then we tend to lose focus on the exact Statement that had been sought.

What you are asking is important, but Sen. Wetangula is seeking a specific answer on a specific person and a specific situation. The trouble of riding on other people’s statements is that we tend to lose focus on the original statement sought. That is my view. If you wish to have a general statement on the security of students, which is important, I would advise you to seek a specific statement on that, so that we do not dilute what the other Senator had specifically asked, having thought about it.

You can go on.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, for allowing me to request for a Statement from the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations on the kidnap and murder of Peter Kalamu Nyongesa. Pursuant to Standing Order No.45 (2) (b) , I rise to seek a Statement from the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations on the kidnap and subsequent murder of Peter Kalamu Nyongesa. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the deceased was a Fourth Year student at Jomo Kenyatta University of Agriculture and Technology (JKUAT) . He was on an academic trip to Mtwapa Town, Kilifi County, organised for the Fourth Year Agricultural Economics students. He was kidnapped on the 27th of September 2016 and his body found dumped on the Mtwapa Beach on 1st October, 2016. The preliminary post-mortem results reveal that Peter’s neck was broken and his body had multiple injuries inflicted by blunt objects. His body has since been transported to Bungoma County awaiting burial in Mabembe Village, Kapchai Constituency. I can see the Vice-Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations chatting away with Sen. Kivuti while I am seeking a very important Statement relating to a loss of life. In his statement, the Chairman should address the following:-

Hon. Senators, before we go to the next Statement, I have a short Communication.

Thank you, Sen. Wetangula. Sen. Adan.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I am requesting the Senate Minority Leader and as a Member of the same Committee, to give us two weeks because this requires a bit of investigations to be done and also collecting information from various institutions that he has mentioned.

Hon. Senators, I wish to recognize the presence of visiting students and teachers from St. George’s Girls Secondary School, Nairobi County, seated in the Public Gallery.

In our usual tradition of receiving and welcoming visitors to Parliament, I welcome them.

On behalf of the Senate and my own behalf, I wish them a fruitful visit. I hope that they will learn positively from the proceedings of the Senate this afternoon.

Thank you.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg that you indulge me to seek further clarification on this very important matter. As the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations contemplates bringing the Statement, I would have to also include two aspects. The first one is what measures the Government put in place in all our universities to ensure that our children are safe while at college, going home and coming back to college.

The second aspect is that the Senate Minority Leader has spoken to the issue of compensation of the family. Could he also come armed with an answer on the state of compensation to the family of the student who was similarly kidnapped and found murdered in the same manner by the name of Solomon Muruli from Shinyalu---

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, I am not stopping you but I want you to appreciate one thing. Sen. Wetangula has sought a specific Statement on a specific person. The danger is that if we now bring a general situation and another student, then we tend to lose focus on the exact Statement that had been sought.

What you are asking is important, but Sen. Wetangula is seeking a specific answer on a specific person and a specific situation. The trouble of riding on other people’s statements is that we tend to lose focus on the original statement sought. That is my view. If you wish to have a general statement on the security of students, which is important, I would advise you to seek a specific statement on that, so that we do not dilute what the other Senator had specifically asked, having thought about it.

You can go on.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I believe that the Vice Chair has heard you. The rules of the House are that the House does not speak in vain. Therefore, it is up to her to either come when she is ready or promise when she will have the balance of my clarification.

I was just concluding by saying that in the case of Mr. Solomon Muruli who died several years ago, the Government representatives in the House told us that they would compensate the family, but the compensation has not been made to date. If the Vice Chair has an answer, as she goes through, she could tell us the state of that compensation, because the family is waiting for it somewhere in Shinyalu, in a place called Muruhu.

Hon. Senators, before we go to the next Statement, I have a short Communication.

Hon. Senators, I wish to recognize the presence of visiting students and teachers from St. George’s Girls Secondary School, Nairobi County, seated in the Public Gallery.

In our usual tradition of receiving and welcoming visitors to Parliament, I welcome them.

On behalf of the Senate and my own behalf, I wish them a fruitful visit. I hope that they will learn positively from the proceedings of the Senate this afternoon.

Thank you.

Senator Billow.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I emphasize that this is a very important issue and Parliament - not the Executive - has the mandate to protect the Constitution, and in the process ensure the lives of Kenyans are safeguarded. Where the Executive is engaged in excesses, this House has the responsibility and will be answerable to the people of Kenya incase of failure.

It was reported this week that over 220 people have been shot by police in the first six months of this year. About 220 Kenyans shot dead by police! Last year, the

Thank you, Sen. Wangari. Sen. Sang, you may seek your Statement. The Senate Minority Leader (

actual number of people shot and killed by police surpassed the number killed by thugs and other criminals. It is a matter that we must take seriously. I want to ride on the same question to ask the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations to explain the action the Cabinet Secretary (CS) mentioned he is taking against his officers who are killing Kenyans in broad day light in whatever circumstances because these figures are available.

The Independent Policing Oversight Authority (IPOA) is reporting daily, since they carry out investigations. What action is the CS taking on IPOA reports? Not a single report by IPOA has been acted upon by that Ministry.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, since this is a very sensitive issue, would it be in order that we require the CS in charge to come to this House and answer questions directly from the Floor?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, pursuant to Standing Order No. 45 (2) (b) , I rise to seek a Statement from the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations on the murder of Mr. Musa Koech, a resident of Chepkuny Village in Bonchoge, Aldai, Nandi County.

On 23rd September, 2016, Mr. Kirapa, a police officer from Cheptulu Police Post, allegedly shot and killed the said Musa Koech while on his way home at 9.30 p.m. The postmortem results confirmed that the shooting was the cause of the death.

In the Statement the Chairperson should address the following:-

Senator Billow.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I emphasize that this is a very important issue and Parliament - not the Executive - has the mandate to protect the Constitution, and in the process ensure the lives of Kenyans are safeguarded. Where the Executive is engaged in excesses, this House has the responsibility and will be answerable to the people of Kenya incase of failure.

It was reported this week that over 220 people have been shot by police in the first six months of this year. About 220 Kenyans shot dead by police! Last year, the

actual number of people shot and killed by police surpassed the number killed by thugs and other criminals. It is a matter that we must take seriously. I want to ride on the same question to ask the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations to explain the action the Cabinet Secretary (CS) mentioned he is taking against his officers who are killing Kenyans in broad day light in whatever circumstances because these figures are available.

The Independent Policing Oversight Authority (IPOA) is reporting daily, since they carry out investigations. What action is the CS taking on IPOA reports? Not a single report by IPOA has been acted upon by that Ministry.

Senator Kivuti.

Sen. Karaba, how long will you require?

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Sen. Adan.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I request the Senator for Nandi County and other Senators who have requested additional information to give us two weeks to respond.

Sen. Sang, are you okay with two weeks?

Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, what is your point of order? What are you against?

Order, Sen. Murkomen!

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have one final Statement. Pursuant to Standing Order 45 (2) b, I rise to seek a Statement from the Chairperson of the Committee on Education on the leadership crisis at Moi University. In the Statement, the Chairperson should state the following:

Which one is it?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, “bigots” or something like that. If you are referring to human beings that have positions and you have already talked about governors, are you now degrading them or giving them a new terminology, name or position? It is an insult. We would rather call them by the position they hold.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Order. I have the screen.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I can take three weeks. That is a very serious issue.

I have heard you. There are many requests for the Floor. I will give you about a minute or two to seek clarification. Let us have the Senate Minority Leader. The Senate Minority Leader (

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the country will remember that sometime last year, a similar problem arose at the University of Eldoret in respect of an attempt by Sen. Melly - our colleague here - trying to eject Prof. Agenga because she was a Luhyia. The Chair of the Committee worked on it and we got a satisfactory answer. Could the Chair come armed with the results of the investigations into that particular incidence because my fear is that Governor Mandago, having seen Sen. Melly get away with it, thought he could apply the same standard against Prof. Ayiro? Because of the issue of ethnicity cropping up, allow me to inform the country that days after Prof. Agenga had been harassed, Governor Mandago went to the streets in Eldoret and got Luhyia street children. He put then on trucks, went and dumped them in Malaba on the border with Uganda and said that he does not want them.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we would like an update of investigations into Governor Mandago. We would like that investigation to go beyond just the person because when Mandago came from the Criminal Investigation Department (CID) headquarters after being grilled, he arrived in Eldoret Town and was received by tens of thousands of people from the villages. This mindset - primitive as it is - seems to be resonating very well with the locals. If the Government does not move in, I have no apologies to say that just like the issue of the land resource contributed to Post-Election Violence (PEV) , the issue of university opportunities might contribute to violence in Eldoret.

I do not know whether the Clerks-at- the-Table took my instructions on two minutes because I had said that it will strictly be not more than two minutes.

Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, what is your point of order? What are you against?

Order, Sen. Murkomen!

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I thank the Senate Minority Leader for thanking me. It is rare for such an appreciation to come from the Senate Minority Leader. I hope it is genuine because there is nothing hidden in between.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, “bigots” or something like that. If you are referring to human beings that have positions and you have already talked about governors, are you now degrading them or giving them a new terminology, name or position? It is an insult. We would rather call them by the position they hold.

Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, I may not be able to rule because I did not get the word that is galling you so much. I will not be able to deal with that situation.

Please do not take more than two minutes. Sen. Billow.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have a rider on the statement sought by the Senator. It appears that this whole issue is centred around ethnicity in our public universities. This is a matter that the National Cohesion and Integration Commission (NCIC) has often talked about.

Could the Chair table in this House the ethnic composition in the public universities, councils of the senate, the lecturers and particularly the top staff of public universities because that seems to be where the issue is? Yesterday’s report by the same institution brought out that very clearly and this seems to be the genesis of these things. So, let us have that tabled, so that this House can make a decision in terms of policy and the way forward on that matter.

On a point of order.

All the requests are on point of order, unless you want to say something completely different.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the country will remember that sometime last year, a similar problem arose at the University of Eldoret in respect of an attempt by Sen. Melly - our colleague here - trying to eject Prof. Agenga because she was a Luhyia. The Chair of the Committee worked on it and we got a satisfactory answer. Could the Chair come armed with the results of the investigations into that particular incidence because my fear is that Governor Mandago, having seen Sen. Melly get away with it, thought he could apply the same standard against Prof. Ayiro? Because of the issue of ethnicity cropping up, allow me to inform the country that days after Prof. Agenga had been harassed, Governor Mandago went to the streets in Eldoret and got Luhyia street children. He put then on trucks, went and dumped them in Malaba on the border with Uganda and said that he does not want them.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we would like an update of investigations into Governor Mandago. We would like that investigation to go beyond just the person because when Mandago came from the Criminal Investigation Department (CID) headquarters after being grilled, he arrived in Eldoret Town and was received by tens of thousands of people from the villages. This mindset - primitive as it is - seems to be resonating very well with the locals. If the Government does not move in, I have no apologies to say that just like the issue of the land resource contributed to Post-Election Violence (PEV) , the issue of university opportunities might contribute to violence in Eldoret.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this problem is wider than universities. I think a political tendency is trending in this country whereby tribalism is taking the top most consideration in appointment of people beginning with the Government itself. If you form a government which expresses this state itself as the government of two communities---

I know, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

We are doing this to allow Sen. Karaba who is the Chairman of Education Committee to be able to give an indication of when he can give an answer.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I thank the Senate Minority Leader for thanking me. It is rare for such an appreciation to come from the Senate Minority Leader. I hope it is genuine because there is nothing hidden in between.

You cannot say you have to finish because I gave you two minutes. Are you requesting for time or are you saying you have two minutes? Those are two different things but you will have one minute.

coming; and going by what we know, a university means - according to what Sen. (Dr.) Machage was asking - it is a lot. If we are not careful, we might lead to destruction of these universities. So, I need one month.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, sometimes Senators seeking statements are a little bit disadvantaged because the riders that my fellow colleagues have sought with regard to my statement--- it is those riders that require some bit of time. If you look at what I am asking, it does not take more than two days for the Cabinet Secretary to indicate whether he is aware that senior management staff in a university is in acting capacity. It does not require more than two days for the Cabinet Secretary to confirm that he received communication from a council. It does not take more than two days for the Cabinet Secretary to confirm or share to this House as to when he expects to conclude the process.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, with regard to the specific issues that I have raised, two days would be enough for the Chair to come with this statement. I appreciate that the riders are wider. A number of them are policy issues. If the Chair takes two weeks or so, on those broad ones, I would appreciate. However, the statements that I sought are things that are within the knowledge of the Cabinet Secretary and they can be availed within two days. You appreciate that this matter of Moi University is a serious matter that has been in the public domain. Looking at the interest it has generated in this |House, these are serious issues. I would appreciate if the Chair can provide specific answers. This is a one page response to the issues I have raised. Therefore, two days or three days, should be sufficient for the Chair.

The only problem I see with that, Sen. Sang, is that most of the issues raised by your colleagues – we call them riders - You heard my view about people riding on other people’s statements earlier, but since it seems to be a norm that has been accepted, you heard what your colleagues had to say about that specific issue. A lot of what they have said is relevant and pertinent to some of the answers that you have sought. In my view, it cannot be looked at in isolation.

On the other hand, I think asking for a month is far too long because if it a matter of policy, it should be there in the Government policy. Most of the issues that have been raised are questions that if you emphasize the urgency on the relevant officer, then you should be able to get answers. So, as a compromise, two weeks would be sufficient for the whole broad spectrum for you to give an answer on the issues. The reason I say that is, speaking from where I am sitting, the issues that have been raised by your colleagues are serious issues. They pertain to a university. When you talk about Moi University, you talk about an example because there are many public universities in Kenya that may be having similar problems.

So, two weeks are enough.

Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this problem is wider than universities. I think a political tendency is trending in this country whereby tribalism is taking the top most consideration in appointment of people beginning with the Government itself. If you form a government which expresses this state itself as the government of two communities---

Order, Sen. (Prof.) Anyang’-

I know, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

We are doing this to allow Sen. Karaba who is the Chairman of Education Committee to be able to give an indication of when he can give an answer.

In giving that answer, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, let the answer not be given out of the context in which the problem is situated. It is contextual and not isolated. If you think you are going to treat a wound by just pricking at its top, you may not succeed. I am just cautioning the House that the problem is bigger than Moi University and it is the bed of our society today.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, listening to what you have also heard, I am likely to even add one week so that I can take one month so that I will be able to answer all those questions the way you have asked. It is very serious that this thing is

Okay, you can give it now.

Sen. Sang, is one month okay with you?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, sometimes Senators seeking statements are a little bit disadvantaged because the riders that my fellow colleagues have sought with regard to my statement--- it is those riders that require some bit of time. If you look at what I am asking, it does not take more than two days for the Cabinet Secretary to indicate whether he is aware that senior management staff in a university is in acting capacity. It does not require more than two days for the Cabinet Secretary to confirm that he received communication from a council. It does not take more than two days for the Cabinet Secretary to confirm or share to this House as to when he expects to conclude the process.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, with regard to the specific issues that I have raised, two days would be enough for the Chair to come with this statement. I appreciate that the riders are wider. A number of them are policy issues. If the Chair takes two weeks or so, on those broad ones, I would appreciate. However, the statements that I sought are things that are within the knowledge of the Cabinet Secretary and they can be availed within two days. You appreciate that this matter of Moi University is a serious matter that has been in the public domain. Looking at the interest it has generated in this |House, these are serious issues. I would appreciate if the Chair can provide specific answers. This is a one page response to the issues I have raised. Therefore, two days or three days, should be sufficient for the Chair.

provides a link to Rongo-Homabay Road, joining Ogembo-Rongo-Homabay Road (C20) at Riosiri.

(iii) In line with the Presidential directive referred to in part (i) above, the Ministry allocated Kshs400 million this Financial Year 2016/2017 for the improvement of the road to bitumen standards. The tendering process for the same is expected to be completed by the end of the Second Quarter of the Financial Year (December 2016).

Further, the Ministry has also allocated funds in the budget of this Financial Year for the improvement of other roads in the area to improve mobility as indicated below.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I thank the Chairman for the elaborate answer. However, I would like to raise two issues in respect to the answer given.

I would like him to indicate whether the necessary steps have been taken to include the Kenyenye-Nyansembe Road section in the ongoing improvement programme as directed by His Excellency the President.

Secondly, the Kenyenye-Riokindo-Magenche Road is being undertaken under the low volume road infrastructure programme. The Kenyenye-Nyansembe section which is the subject of this question is actually of a higher classification. This is a major highway which attracts higher volumes of traffic.

Could he ensure this reality is taken into consideration at the time of implementation?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it is important to note that with the Department of Roads, there is a lot happening in the countryside. There is drafting and designing of the road which takes a whole year such that the cost overshoots by the time the money is allocated in the Budget.

Could the Chairman make sure that those people who are concerned, particularly the directors of the Kenya National Highways Authority (KeNHA) take a shorter time so that the roads are improved within a short time when they say that there is a necessity of improving them? The process should not be taken through a long protocol or red tape/ bureaucracy before a road is done.

Sen. Karaba, please, remove your card if you have finished with your request.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, is the Chairman, in his own opinion, satisfied that the allocated fund is adequate for the quoted projects? If you look at the connection of Riosiri-Rongo Road in Migori County, its cost is approximately Kshs50 million while another road has been allocated shs80 million. What is the cost per kilometre for bitumisation of these roads?

Natural Resources. I note that Sen. Khaniri is not in. Who is the Chairman on Committee of Lands and Natural Resources? Is it Sen. Kivuti? I thought he was here.

Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

Okay, you can give it now.

You have to pursue that under Sagana-Kagio Road. I am repeating myself; this was a specific statement sought by Sen. Obure.

provides a link to Rongo-Homabay Road, joining Ogembo-Rongo-Homabay Road (C20) at Riosiri.

(iii) In line with the Presidential directive referred to in part (i) above, the Ministry allocated Kshs400 million this Financial Year 2016/2017 for the improvement of the road to bitumen standards. The tendering process for the same is expected to be completed by the end of the Second Quarter of the Financial Year (December 2016).

Further, the Ministry has also allocated funds in the budget of this Financial Year for the improvement of other roads in the area to improve mobility as indicated below.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I thank the Chairman for the elaborate answer. However, I would like to raise two issues in respect to the answer given.

I would like him to indicate whether the necessary steps have been taken to include the Kenyenye-Nyansembe Road section in the ongoing improvement programme as directed by His Excellency the President.

Secondly, the Kenyenye-Riokindo-Magenche Road is being undertaken under the low volume road infrastructure programme. The Kenyenye-Nyansembe section which is the subject of this question is actually of a higher classification. This is a major highway which attracts higher volumes of traffic.

Could he ensure this reality is taken into consideration at the time of implementation?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, once again, I thank Sen. Hargura for this answer. However, you have heard him inform this Senate that there is an ongoing study being carried out through PPP. I would like to know when this feasibility study is expected to be complete. If he could give an indication regarding the timelines when travellers on this route could expect to be relieved of the current difficulties?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to get a clarification, noting that this is a road I use almost every weekend. It is not once that we have had to spend the night on the road due to the congestion. It is not limited to Naivasha, but even at the weigh bridge. You can spend the whole night there when there is crazy traffic jam. There was a Presidential decree on the opening up of the road or the extension of the Green Park Road through

Eburu-Suguroi-Mastoo-Munanda-Kiptangwany to join the Elementaita-Mau Narok Road that would ease traffic and congestion on this road. What are the plans about that road? It would also help in reducing the congestion.

The other clarification is on the feasibility study on the PPP. What are the timelines? This has been said over and over for a long time. What timelines is the Ministry talking about to complete this road?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I thank Sen. Obure for seeking this statement. The Chairman has tried to answer. Although he is struggling to answer, the congestion on this road is serious. Even at midnight when you travel from Nairobi to upcountry towards western Kenya, the traffic jam is just like during the day. This road was built before Independence. It is still as narrow as it was then. The Government is ambitious. It is building the Standard Gauge Railway (SGR) which will not be used by motor vehicles.

As Sen. Obure said, all the way to Nakuru there is traffic, but through Kericho to Kisii there is less traffic. The traffic from Nakuru proceeds to Eldoret all the way to Busia

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. With regard to the first question on whether the necessary steps have been taken, I would like to say the presidential directive was made in April this year. By that time, funds had already been allocated. Therefore, the necessary steps have been taken because the whole issue was on

how fast funds could be allocated. The rest is just the procurement process which they have indicated that it should be through by December this year.

The other question is on the issue of the standards where we have a section of the road being covered under the low volume sealed roads while the other sections, the highway, are built to higher standards. I want to explain the difference between these two. When you talk of low volume sealed roads, it is just a matter of stage construction. My understanding as an engineer is that we do the normal pavement design to a level where it can accommodate the existing traffic. Once the traffic has reached the standard required for that low volume, then you can easily upgrade by just adding the other layers on top. It is a matter of taking into account the resource constraint. It is acceptable and it will be improved when the traffic on that road reaches the level which is required.

Sen. Karaba talked of delay in the design and procurement process. I would like to say that the issue is the funding. It is not the procurement process. So long as the funds are there, the design can be done quickly. Most of these works are improvement, so it is easy to design. What causes the problem is the availability of the funding.

Sen. (Dr.) Machage asked about the disparity in the funding, specifically for improvement. Improvement does not necessarily mean building it to bitumen standards. There are different levels of improvement. That is where the funding is also different. It is not the same kind of activity.

Are you seeking the Floor again Sen. Karaba?

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. Last time, the Vice- Chairperson told us that Kshs45 million was allocated to repair Sagana-Kagio-Kutus Road, but I disputed it because I felt it was not enough. I was told that the road was to be completed by the end of June. However, funds were spent on that road and it is still in pathetic condition. We are now in the month of October. Could he tell us what is happening? We want to know what this is all about because funds are allocated, spent and nothing to show on the ground.

You have to pursue that under Sagana-Kagio Road. I am repeating myself; this was a specific statement sought by Sen. Obure.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, Sen. Obure sought a statement regarding persistent traffic congestion along the Nairobi- Naivasha-Nakuru Road and possible expansion of the road. Regarding the same, he sought the following:-

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, once again, I thank Sen. Hargura for this answer. However, you have heard him inform this Senate that there is an ongoing study being carried out through PPP. I would like to know when this feasibility study is expected to be complete. If he could give an indication regarding the timelines when travellers on this route could expect to be relieved of the current difficulties?

Park Road, which would ease congestion. However, he has not given a commitment as to when that information should come to this House. Could it then come from the Chair?

Chairperson, can you give a commitment on the timelines?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, this statement is as serious as has been stated. People cannot travel at night because the road is congested. Almost 53 years after Independence we are talking about a feasibility study on the road, which is a lifeline of Kenya. Would it be appropriate that we continue asking the Chairman when you can direct the Senate Majority Leader to go and get the information from the CS? Goods perish on the highway because of congestion on the road.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, a similar question is still lingering in my mind. The Ministry of Roads and Infrastructure just conducts business as usual until we ask questions for them to attend to these roads. Do they not have a section that deals with inspections of these roads? This will enable them to assess increase of traffic, potholes and destroyed bridges so that they repair them immediately without Senators necessarily coming here to ask questions. This is our concern. We are not against anything. The Ministry of Roads and Infrastructure must be proactive. They should assess which sections of the roads in Kenya are congested, for instance, the one from Makutano to Wang’uru to Embu.

Every other day, there is an accident just because the road is narrow due to the unexpected development. The development rate is higher than that of the road. Why can the road constructors not assess the development of the neighbourhood so that they can enlarge the road as per the population demands?

Very well. Proceed, Chairman.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the question raised has to do with timelines; when the PPP will be completed and when the construction will be done. We will have to get extra information from the Cabinet Secretary for Roads and Infrastructure. This will require time. I do not have the timelines now. There is also the issue of the presidential directive to improve the Green Park Road. I have to get more information from the Cabinet Secretary for Transport and Infrastructure.

I would like to inform Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo that when we talk about a dual carriage, it means separating the traffic moving in either direction, so that each of them has its own lane. The carriage way could be three or four lanes, just like we have on Thika Road, with a minimum of two lanes in either direction. Therefore, the study will determine how many lanes we will require in either direction, based on the existing traffic and the projected one. That will be part of the study. I will ask for more information so that we can get these timelines from the CS.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Chairman is avoiding my question. Could you direct him to answer?

To my knowledge, the Chairman has attempted to answer the question. Let us be fair.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I hear the Chairperson on the additional details, especially on the timelines and expansion of Green

Park Road, which would ease congestion. However, he has not given a commitment as to when that information should come to this House. Could it then come from the Chair?

Chairperson, can you give a commitment on the timelines?

Hon. Senators, I am informed that the movers of several Bills are not in the House. Therefore, I will defer Orders No.12, 13 and 15.

Second Readings

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, this statement is as serious as has been stated. People cannot travel at night because the road is congested. Almost 53 years after Independence we are talking about a feasibility study on the road, which is a lifeline of Kenya. Would it be appropriate that we continue asking the Chairman when you can direct the Senate Majority Leader to go and get the information from the CS? Goods perish on the highway because of congestion on the road.

Due to other issues that have to be considered before the Mover moves the Bill, we will hold Order No.16 and go straight to Order No.18.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I also listened to the Chairman when he was giving the statement. The Ministry is just doing a public relations exercise, when this is actually a serious issue. I used that road two weeks ago and spent about eight hours in traffic.

Other than that, I think the priorities of the same Ministry are upside down. As I talk of the feasibility studies, we should also consider the Magadi Road which runs from Bomas of Kenya to Ongata Rongai and Kiserian. In fact, many people are moving away from that area to live in other areas because of traffic congestion. Since a new CS came on board, we do not hear much about the work of that Ministry.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I will not overemphasize the need for expansion of this road. However, on the timelines, the issues to be clarified are quite few. I request that you direct that he gives the additional information in one week. We do not want to interrogate a new Statement and determine whether we require the CS to come to the House to answer this issue.

Chairperson, one of the

Order! Taking cognisance of

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I know the Senate Majority Leader is the Mover of the Bill. It is his Bill and I am sure he wants the support of every Member. Is he in order to describe my request for further clarification on the point as “vagrancies of the Senator for Nandi?”

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I said so. If there is need to modify that word, I am willing to do so. However, I said that Sen. Sang is disrupting me.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to move:-

THAT, the Assisted Reproductive Technology Bill (National Assembly Bill No.36 of 2014) be now read a Second Time.

This is a very important Bill that has come from the National Assembly. It deals with a matter that has been covered widely in the media and public discourse for a while now; namely, how to regulate and control technology that is used to assist mothers or parties to a marriage, who are unable to have children through the natural way of sexual intercourse.

This Bill does four things. First, it regulates assisted reproductive technology, establishes the Assisted Reproductive Technology Authority (ARTA) , prohibits certain practices in connection with assisted reproductive technology and makes provisions in relation to children born out of assisted reproductive technology processes. Those are the key things that this Bill does.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I will highlight a couple of clauses. The first one is Clause 4 which establishes ARTA. The next one is Clause 5 that deals with the functions

of the Authority which includes development of standards, regulations and guidelines in connection with assisted reproductive technology. Secondly, there is the issue of undertaking research on the conduct and control of assisted reproductive technology, among other functions. There are more than 10 functions. The other Clauses between Clause 6 and 11 deal with the usual parameters of running an authority, including but not limited to appointment of a director, and how the Board will conduct its activities.

Let me also highlight the provisions in Part 3 of the Bill which includes Clause

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I appreciate that this is a very technical subject. However, can the Senate Majority Leader briefly explain, especially this particular aspect of a child born out of science and a child born out of sexual intercourse? In this particular sense of being a human being, can he shed more light?

Order! Taking cognisance of

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for protecting me from the vagrancies of the Senator for Nandi County.

What is it, Sen. Sang?

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I know the Senate Majority Leader is the Mover of the Bill. It is his Bill and I am sure he wants the support of every Member. Is he in order to describe my request for further clarification on the point as “vagrancies of the Senator for Nandi?”

Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki, did you actually say so?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I said so. If there is need to modify that word, I am willing to do so. However, I said that Sen. Sang is disrupting me.

Order! What you said was not palatable with the intellect and fairness of the description of the character of Sen. Sang. Could you, therefore, withdraw and apologise?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I withdraw and apologise.

Very well, proceed then.

I was on Clause 31 which deals with surrogacy. All this business is about surrogacy where parties to a marriage are not able to procreate. The material used from both parties or one of the parties, can be implanted in a natural woman for purposes of carrying the pregnancy until birth. After birth, the legal rights that the surrogate mother had on the child terminate immediately unless there is an agreement to the contrary.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, Clause 31 provides that a surrogate mother will not be less than 25 years of age. There must be a specific request by a party to a marriage to carry out the surrogacy.

The other provision which I wanted to highlight is Clause 31 (2) which provides that:-

“The surrogate mother shall carry the child on behalf of the parties to a marriage and shall relinquish all parental rights at birth over the child unless a contrary intention is provided.” Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, under Clause 32, for a surrogate mother to carry a child on behalf of the parties to a marriage, there must be a written consent in order to create parameters of rights and obligations of the parties.

In summary, this Bill, first, legalises and regulates the issue of surrogate mothers. It provides an opportunity for parents who cannot give birth to children through the normal biological way of sexual intercourse to have children scientifically by providing for a surrogate mother to carry the child, based on reproductive material donated by the parties to a marriage.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, that relationship is now being legalised because at the moment there is no legal framework for it. First, it protects surrogate mothers from abuse by parties to a marriage. Secondly, it protects the rights of the donors of the material so that once the surrogate mother fulfills her job, then the rights of the parties to a marriage are not diminished in any way. Finally, it is to equalize children who are born through surrogacy with children born through the natural way.

The Bill establishes a regulatory body that will develop standards and guidelines because there are many other issues of a scientific, ethical, medical and socio-cultural nature that will arise in the implementation of this new idea about surrogacy. It is new in the sense of the scientific aspect of it but we know that in traditional African societies, surrogacy of some sort was also permitted. It was not scientific, but more of a socio- cultural thing. The whole idea is the same. Therefore, it is my pleasure to introduce this Bill by way of Second Reading.

With those remarks, I beg to move. I request Sen. Wangari to second.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I rise to support this Bill. I will take a short time to refer to only one clause in this Bill. I will seek an amendment to this Bill to delete that clause. I am referring to Clause 26 (e) that states that the authority shall not issue a license that allows the replacing of a nucleus of a cell of an embryo with a

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you will pardon us because we have just come from a long recess. These things are happening a lot today. First of all, the cost of IVF is exorbitant in hospitals. It is not affordable to many women. In fact, the lady

There are issues that Sen. (Prof.) Lesan proposes to move an amendment on. Otherwise, with no other interest, I would have called on the Mover to reply. In the rules of the House, I am not supposed to listen to your suggestion that you are thinking of moving an amendment. Instead, there should have been an amendment already an hour before the commencement of this discussion on my Table. I am not privy to that, unless the Secretariat gives me some information.

What is it, Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki?

has been outlawed. I would be looking to see that during, maybe, the Committee stage we would have the issue of the consequences of what happens if someone goes that way.

If you look at Part 4 of the Rights of Parents, Donors and Children, the one thing this Bill does is that it equalises the children of this country. If you remember, Chair, during the last Session, I moved the Bill that was supporting adoptive leave for mothers, in an amendment to the Employment Act and my argument was simple. If you read Article 53 (1) of the Constitution on the specific application of rights, in fact, it is very specific to children. That every child has the right to; (a) to a name and nationality from birth to free and compulsory basic education to basic nutrition all the way to (f).

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, this Bill does not allow us to categorise a child as a biological child, an adopted child, an IVF child or a surrogate child. It equalises the rights of children. It gives those rights and does not segregate on how the child was born as long as they are born, whether through IVF, adoption, biological and so forth. Children must share the enjoyment of the rights as provided for under Article 53.

There is also the issue of access of information that has been dealt with by this Bill because under Article 35, any institution of Government has the right to actually release or rather any person has the right to obtain any information from a government institution. It gives the procedure of how one can access information. That is Part 33(5) and Article 33. The first one is the person applying must be over 18. A minor cannot walk into this Authority and ask.

The Temporary Speaker, Sir, children cannot walk to the Authority to find out whether they were born from IVF or not. If they do so, they would need to be accompanied by a guardian with a written application. However, if you are an adult and you want to find out how you were born, that information cannot be denied from you because it is provided under Article 33. This Authority also we will have to keep the register. It will need to know how many children have actually been born from IVF.

The other issue that I am very passionate about is surrogacy. However contentious it is, I look at the families that are going through the agony of having to go through surrogacy. I know it is happening because even in our culture, it used to happen. However, there has been no legal framework of how this should be done. In fact, if I am a surrogate mother for someone or for a couple and I decide that after birth I want to keep that child, there is no way the parents even with the prior agreement have any way of claiming that child. Secondly, for a surrogate mother even when someone carries your baby, you have to go through the adoption process to get your baby. Those are the laws that we are talking about in Kenya.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the adoption process in Kenya is not only tedious, but it is expensive and almost impossible. First, it is a very expensive affair, you have got to engage legal help and it takes a long time. The issue of surrogacy has to be controlled in a legal framework. This is the only chance that we can do that, but the children are also protected under Articles 30 and 31. A person cannot be surrogate mother unless you are 18 years and unless you make a written consent and agree that you relinquish all parental rights at birth over the child. Of course, unless a contrary intention is proved.

That is also another issue that we will have to look at during the amendment stage to see what exactly it means that when I agree to be a surrogate, am I allowed to change my mind? The surrogacy agreements are provided. There is also need for counseling, especially for persons who want to find out whether they were born through an IVF. This

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I agree with your suggestion that I can move this amendment at the Committee Stage. I feel strongly that biology has no boundaries and our country needs to move along with this technology. I would, therefore, still want to move my amendment.

Very well. It is your constitutional right. I will, therefore, call upon the Mover to reply.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, in reply, I would like to say that in order to provide the constitutional foundation for this Bill which in my view is Article 43 (1) of the Constitution which says:-

Every person has the right—

It is so granted.

Next Order! Second Reading

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the purpose of this Bill is to amend the Public Appointment (Parliamentary Approval) Act, 2011 so as to provide for the procedure for Parliamentary approval of constitutional statutory appointees where the approval of both Houses is required.

It is important to note that the Public Appointment (Parliamentary Approval) Act, 2011 came into force on November, 2011 well before the Senate had been operationalized under the Constitution of Kenya 2010.

In the course of the implementation of the Act, it was realized that the Act does not provide for the procedure to be followed where the law requires the approval of the

candidates by both Houses of Parliament. It is, therefore, to address a lacuna, which particularly became apparent last year during the approval of the nominee for the position of the Inspector-General of Police who under Article 245(2)(a) of the Constitution is required to be appointed by the President with the approval of both Houses. In that particular instance, due to the gap in the law, and taking into account the strict fourteen days timelines as stipulated in the Public Appointments Parliamentary Act, the Speakers of both Houses directed that the vetting of the nominee for appointment to the position of the Inspector-General be conducted jointly by both Houses, in particular, the Departmental Committee on Administration and National Security of the National Assembly and the Standing Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations. This posed a lot of challenge because there were very many Committee Members who sat together for very many days to go through all those procedures.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you will recall that after several Senators raised concerns about the procedure that had been followed in the vetting of the nominee to the position of Inspector-General, you clarified that the establishment of a joint Committee of the two Houses for vetting of the nominee was an exceptional one taken out of necessity and was not intended to be the general rule or the procedure to be applied for the future.

In that case, it was further noted that it was important that the timeliness in the Public Appointments (Parliamentary Approval) Act which was replicated in Section 12 of the National Police Service Act, be scrutinized to ensure the practicality of the timelines in the context of the bicameral Parliament and, therefore, referred the matter to the Standing Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights for further interrogation.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Public Appointments (Parliamentary Approval) (Amendment) Bill, 2016 is, therefore, intended to cure that. This Bill is therefore intended to cure the challenges I have just highlighted so as to reflect the existing bicameral structure.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Bill seeks to introduce amendments to Sections 2, 4, 5, 8, 9 and 13 of The Public Appointment (Parliamentary Approval) Act and Section 12 of The National Police Service Act. You will note that Clause 4 of the Bill sets out the manner in which the notification of the nomination of the position requiring the approval of both Houses should be carried. The provision makes it mandatory for appointing authorities to notify the Speakers of both Houses of Parliament in writing. We have proposed that where a nomination requires the approval of both Houses of Parliament, the process will commence in the National Assembly and end in the Senate. This is in tandem with the role of the Senate the world-over as a House of review which is a second sober thought on matters of national interest.

Clause 6 provides the timelines within which a committee of each House shall consider nomination and table its report in the relevant House of Parliament for debate. A committee shall have 14 days from the date of notification of nomination to consider the nomination and report back to the House while the House will have seven days to consider the report and make its resolution.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, to ensure that each House complies with the stipulated timelines, Clause 9 of the Bill provides that after the expiry of the period of consideration and Parliament has neither approved nor rejected the nomination of candidates, the candidates shall be deemed to have been approved for appointment. Further, if either House of Parliament has neither approved nor rejected nomination of

There are issues that Sen. (Prof.) Lesan proposes to move an amendment on. Otherwise, with no other interest, I would have called on the Mover to reply. In the rules of the House, I am not supposed to listen to your suggestion that you are thinking of moving an amendment. Instead, there should have been an amendment already an hour before the commencement of this discussion on my Table. I am not privy to that, unless the Secretariat gives me some information.

What is it, Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki?

candidate, that House shall be deemed to have approved the nomination of the candidate and the other House shall proceed accordingly.

The Bill also clarifies that a candidate shall be deemed to be approved if the nomination is approved by both Houses. Therefore, if one House rejects a candidate, that nomination is deemed to have been rejected by both Houses. As a result, the nominating panel will be required to submit a fresh name for approval.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, one of the consequences of this Bill will be the recognition of the role of the Senate in all important processes of parliamentary approval of public appointments. By entrenching the vital role of the Senate in approval, the Bill will bring clarity in the procedure to be followed in due approvals such as the approval of the Inspector General of Police (IGP) and the Governor of the Central Bank of Kenya (CBK).

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, with those few remarks, I beg to move. I request Sen. Elachi who is our Majority Whip to second this particular Bill. I thank you.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I rise to support The Public Appointment (Parliamentary Approval) (Amendment) Bill (Senate Bill No.9 of 2016) . You will realise that for the past four years, we have had different appointments that have taken place in our country. The Senate is a parliamentary institution that also works very closely with different appointees that we have today. These include the Cabinet Secretaries (CS) , parastatal board members and many others. Considering the work we do, we have to relate with others and keep the relationship.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you will realise that most of the time when you meet a CS, for example, the fear they have for Members of the National Assembly is a different from Members of the Senate. The reason is the perception that vetting is done by the National Assembly. Therefore, they believe that what the National Assembly says is supposed to happen. If the Senate speaks, it is as if you are negotiating and lobbying. I will give a critical example of the Kenya Airways. When the Senate conducted an investigation on the challenges facing the Kenya Airways, there was a conflict with a committee in the other House because of the same. Since the appointees or those who were supposed to manage certain areas are vetted by one House of Parliament, then they discover that they are not supposed to be accountable to this House but to the National Assembly. This is something we need to work around.

Among key institutions that serve both county and national governments are the CBK and the IGPs Office. As much as we have different levels of Government, more importantly, we have national security that is central and key and it has to remain a function of the national Government. Therefore, both Houses must have an opportunity to vet the person assuming office. The CBK has a governor. We have to ensure that they respect the CBK. Maybe we do not get it right and that is why we have such problems. I believe this amendment will resolve this problem. The key object of the Bill is to provide the procedure of parliamentary approval of constitutional and statutory appointees where the approval of both Houses is required.

The other example is the National Cohesion and Integration Commission (NCIC) which is concerned with peace building in this country. When we brought in the “Kaparo Team”, it was important for them to be vetted by both Houses. That was done by a joint committee comprising of Members of both Houses. We are now headed to an election. As Parliament, we have not appreciated that we are in a bicameral system where both

That is an important observation. We have two levels at which you can move your amendments. I was

thinking of advising Sen. (Prof.) Lesan that if he is so convinced, his amendments should be moved at the Committee Stage.

However, as you move the amendments, I know you will consider the constitutional inclinations of this country in terms of parenthood. Just because a country in Central America has three parents for a child may not be constitutionally acceptable in Kenya. However, it is your right to consider moving an amendment at that level. Otherwise you should have moved it at this level if due diligence was considered. Do you want to say something?

just today. Tomorrow, we shall have a different challenge within the same sector and we will need this statutory law to support us in ensuring – whether it is the IG or the Deputy IG or any other person – if it is the vetting that is supposed to be done by both Houses so that we do not have questions.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you realize that we are creating a wall around our turfs because we believe when we enter that turf, we bring the political shenanigans that we play outside there even within our own space where we are supposed to work without looking at which party we belong to. We must now work as a Parliament because we have an oversight role to play. That time, it did not tell us we have a role to oversee as Jubilee Party. It is us, as Parliament. How can we create a conducive environment for our people to do business and feel that they have an environment where they can deliver services to our people?

I beg to second.

Thank you very much, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for allowing me to contribute in support of this Bill. This Bill concerns the two Houses of Parliament. Whether it is to be amended or not, we are talking about Parliament. Whereas Parliament has been referred to many times as the two Houses; bicameral Parliament, there are instances where the Senate is seen to be out of the scene when some things are done particularly in the National Assembly. Some of these things done in the National Assembly are like the ones that we have here. That is the reason why the amendment that has been moved by Sen. Adan is pertinent. Without checks and balances, which are there in the Constitution, we cannot check what might happen in the National Assembly.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, in the absence of our participation, it is seen and concluded like some of the vetting and appointments that were done even before the Senate came into place, it is like it was supposed to be done by the National Assembly. I am happy that with this kind of amendment, we are going to include the Senate as a fallback position to compare us and the National Assembly.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I would also imagine that if somebody was to be rejected through vetting by the National Assembly and that person is known to have done well countrywide and he has sympathy from the Senate, the Senate will not have any window to express its sympathy to this person who has been rejected by the National Assembly.

Therefore, it is important for us to reconsider the position of the Senate vis-a-vis that of the National Assembly. Going by what we observe in other countries and in other democracies, the Senate is the final voice of any country in case of any dispute. It is so because it is the Senate which is thought to be the final one, particularly in the impeachment proceedings. It can impeach the governor; it can impeach even the President and not the National Assembly.

So, if it is so articulate in the Constitution that the Senate has that role of impeachment, oversight and ensuring that devolution is implemented in the country, it is therefore, prudent that we need to understand that aspect of the law that is missing when it comes to vetting and the appointment of some of the public officers in the Government. Some of these public officers have been vetted; some of them have been humiliated by

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, in reply, I would like to say that in order to provide the constitutional foundation for this Bill which in my view is Article 43 (1) of the Constitution which says:-

Every person has the right—

the National Assembly by asking them questions that are not relevant to their work. That balancing act can even send shockwaves to some of these officers in the field.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, they might be demoralized if they discover that some of the panelists who are interviewing them have inferior qualifications. So, it is important that this amendment is introduced so that even the members who will be involved in the vetting should have higher qualifications or same qualifications as the interviewees. If you go down to Members of County Assemblies (MCAs), you find an MCA who does not have a degree is interviewing somebody who has a degree and he is asking them irrelevant questions. The same thing can happen in the National Assembly.

If the same happens, then you find that we might lose a very important person who could run the affairs of this country. That is why we are now trying to reintroduce the position of the Senate. Therefore, the Senate is very important and it should be seen as a fallback position for anybody who can be rejected in the National Assembly. We take it that the Senate should be the final House to decide whether what the National Assembly has done is fair or not.

Of late, we have introduced the idea of having the Bills that originate from the National Assembly passing through the Senate. That is a very important introduction. That introduction has given the Senate power that was not there before and the Senators feel that they are obligated to discuss and come up with resolutions that can differ with the National Assembly. In cases where they differ, there is the Mediation Committee. If there is a difference between what the National Assembly finds out through vetting, the difference is to be registered between that House and the Senate, then the Mediation Committee will solve the problem.

That is why it is important for us to be involved. This is because without such involvement, then the victim will be the person who, otherwise, would have passed if the Senate had put its stamp on. That is why we are saying that the amendment through this Bill is very good. It is a very good introduction because it will act like a supreme organ such as the High Court or Supreme Court. That is how it is even in the Judiciary where somebody will seek remedy or further hearing in the Supreme Court if he will not be satisfied with the lower court. The same case should be developed in the House.

This House is called Parliament which is made up of two Houses. It is very hard for anybody else out there to know whether it is the National Assembly which has done that job or whether it is the Senate. Now that we have a bicameral Parliament, why do we not give full powers to the bicameral system instead of giving it half-way? When we allow the National Assembly to continue without involving the Senate, the bicameral aspect will, therefore, be missing in the final aspect of such a decision which will have been arrived at by the National Assembly.

I would suggest that we continue with this kind of amendment. It should be appreciated that without the Senate, not much would happen from the National Assembly. We are the people who should be saying how and what the Senate should be doing. We should be able to compare ourselves largely with what happens with the other democracies in the world. We should compare ourselves with America, India, Britain and many others. Some of us have been to these countries and have learnt a lot. The Senate should then be the final House. If anything comes from the National Assembly, it should be seen like it is coming to the final House for decision making because this is a House of records and with very serious Members.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the purpose of this Bill is to amend the Public Appointment (Parliamentary Approval) Act, 2011 so as to provide for the procedure for Parliamentary approval of constitutional statutory appointees where the approval of both Houses is required.

It is important to note that the Public Appointment (Parliamentary Approval) Act, 2011 came into force on November, 2011 well before the Senate had been operationalized under the Constitution of Kenya 2010.

In the course of the implementation of the Act, it was realized that the Act does not provide for the procedure to be followed where the law requires the approval of the

candidates by both Houses of Parliament. It is, therefore, to address a lacuna, which particularly became apparent last year during the approval of the nominee for the position of the Inspector-General of Police who under Article 245(2)(a) of the Constitution is required to be appointed by the President with the approval of both Houses. In that particular instance, due to the gap in the law, and taking into account the strict fourteen days timelines as stipulated in the Public Appointments Parliamentary Act, the Speakers of both Houses directed that the vetting of the nominee for appointment to the position of the Inspector-General be conducted jointly by both Houses, in particular, the Departmental Committee on Administration and National Security of the National Assembly and the Standing Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations. This posed a lot of challenge because there were very many Committee Members who sat together for very many days to go through all those procedures.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you will recall that after several Senators raised concerns about the procedure that had been followed in the vetting of the nominee to the position of Inspector-General, you clarified that the establishment of a joint Committee of the two Houses for vetting of the nominee was an exceptional one taken out of necessity and was not intended to be the general rule or the procedure to be applied for the future.

In that case, it was further noted that it was important that the timeliness in the Public Appointments (Parliamentary Approval) Act which was replicated in Section 12 of the National Police Service Act, be scrutinized to ensure the practicality of the timelines in the context of the bicameral Parliament and, therefore, referred the matter to the Standing Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights for further interrogation.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Public Appointments (Parliamentary Approval) (Amendment) Bill, 2016 is, therefore, intended to cure that. This Bill is therefore intended to cure the challenges I have just highlighted so as to reflect the existing bicameral structure.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Bill seeks to introduce amendments to Sections 2, 4, 5, 8, 9 and 13 of The Public Appointment (Parliamentary Approval) Act and Section 12 of The National Police Service Act. You will note that Clause 4 of the Bill sets out the manner in which the notification of the nomination of the position requiring the approval of both Houses should be carried. The provision makes it mandatory for appointing authorities to notify the Speakers of both Houses of Parliament in writing. We have proposed that where a nomination requires the approval of both Houses of Parliament, the process will commence in the National Assembly and end in the Senate. This is in tandem with the role of the Senate the world-over as a House of review which is a second sober thought on matters of national interest.

Clause 6 provides the timelines within which a committee of each House shall consider nomination and table its report in the relevant House of Parliament for debate. A committee shall have 14 days from the date of notification of nomination to consider the nomination and report back to the House while the House will have seven days to consider the report and make its resolution.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, to ensure that each House complies with the stipulated timelines, Clause 9 of the Bill provides that after the expiry of the period of consideration and Parliament has neither approved nor rejected the nomination of candidates, the candidates shall be deemed to have been approved for appointment. Further, if either House of Parliament has neither approved nor rejected nomination of

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I rise to support The Public Appointment (Parliamentary Approval) (Amendment) Bill (Senate Bill No.9 of 2016) . You will realise that for the past four years, we have had different appointments that have taken place in our country. The Senate is a parliamentary institution that also works very closely with different appointees that we have today. These include the Cabinet Secretaries (CS) , parastatal board members and many others. Considering the work we do, we have to relate with others and keep the relationship.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you will realise that most of the time when you meet a CS, for example, the fear they have for Members of the National Assembly is a different from Members of the Senate. The reason is the perception that vetting is done by the National Assembly. Therefore, they believe that what the National Assembly says is supposed to happen. If the Senate speaks, it is as if you are negotiating and lobbying. I will give a critical example of the Kenya Airways. When the Senate conducted an investigation on the challenges facing the Kenya Airways, there was a conflict with a committee in the other House because of the same. Since the appointees or those who were supposed to manage certain areas are vetted by one House of Parliament, then they discover that they are not supposed to be accountable to this House but to the National Assembly. This is something we need to work around.

Among key institutions that serve both county and national governments are the CBK and the IGPs Office. As much as we have different levels of Government, more importantly, we have national security that is central and key and it has to remain a function of the national Government. Therefore, both Houses must have an opportunity to vet the person assuming office. The CBK has a governor. We have to ensure that they respect the CBK. Maybe we do not get it right and that is why we have such problems. I believe this amendment will resolve this problem. The key object of the Bill is to provide the procedure of parliamentary approval of constitutional and statutory appointees where the approval of both Houses is required.

The other example is the National Cohesion and Integration Commission (NCIC) which is concerned with peace building in this country. When we brought in the “Kaparo Team”, it was important for them to be vetted by both Houses. That was done by a joint committee comprising of Members of both Houses. We are now headed to an election. As Parliament, we have not appreciated that we are in a bicameral system where both

Since there is no other request, I call upon the Mover to reply.

I defer putting of the question as requested by the Mover.

Next order!

Order, hon. Senators. The Clerk-at-the-Table did not realise that the Mover of Order No.17 is ready. So, can you read the next order?

Second Reading

Thank you very much, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for allowing me to contribute in support of this Bill. This Bill concerns the two Houses of Parliament. Whether it is to be amended or not, we are talking about Parliament. Whereas Parliament has been referred to many times as the two Houses; bicameral Parliament, there are instances where the Senate is seen to be out of the scene when some things are done particularly in the National Assembly. Some of these things done in the National Assembly are like the ones that we have here. That is the reason why the amendment that has been moved by Sen. Adan is pertinent. Without checks and balances, which are there in the Constitution, we cannot check what might happen in the National Assembly.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, in the absence of our participation, it is seen and concluded like some of the vetting and appointments that were done even before the Senate came into place, it is like it was supposed to be done by the National Assembly. I am happy that with this kind of amendment, we are going to include the Senate as a fallback position to compare us and the National Assembly.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I would also imagine that if somebody was to be rejected through vetting by the National Assembly and that person is known to have done well countrywide and he has sympathy from the Senate, the Senate will not have any window to express its sympathy to this person who has been rejected by the National Assembly.

Therefore, it is important for us to reconsider the position of the Senate vis-a-vis that of the National Assembly. Going by what we observe in other countries and in other democracies, the Senate is the final voice of any country in case of any dispute. It is so because it is the Senate which is thought to be the final one, particularly in the impeachment proceedings. It can impeach the governor; it can impeach even the President and not the National Assembly.

So, if it is so articulate in the Constitution that the Senate has that role of impeachment, oversight and ensuring that devolution is implemented in the country, it is therefore, prudent that we need to understand that aspect of the law that is missing when it comes to vetting and the appointment of some of the public officers in the Government. Some of these public officers have been vetted; some of them have been humiliated by

the National Assembly by asking them questions that are not relevant to their work. That balancing act can even send shockwaves to some of these officers in the field.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, they might be demoralized if they discover that some of the panelists who are interviewing them have inferior qualifications. So, it is important that this amendment is introduced so that even the members who will be involved in the vetting should have higher qualifications or same qualifications as the interviewees. If you go down to Members of County Assemblies (MCAs), you find an MCA who does not have a degree is interviewing somebody who has a degree and he is asking them irrelevant questions. The same thing can happen in the National Assembly.

If the same happens, then you find that we might lose a very important person who could run the affairs of this country. That is why we are now trying to reintroduce the position of the Senate. Therefore, the Senate is very important and it should be seen as a fallback position for anybody who can be rejected in the National Assembly. We take it that the Senate should be the final House to decide whether what the National Assembly has done is fair or not.

Of late, we have introduced the idea of having the Bills that originate from the National Assembly passing through the Senate. That is a very important introduction. That introduction has given the Senate power that was not there before and the Senators feel that they are obligated to discuss and come up with resolutions that can differ with the National Assembly. In cases where they differ, there is the Mediation Committee. If there is a difference between what the National Assembly finds out through vetting, the difference is to be registered between that House and the Senate, then the Mediation Committee will solve the problem.

That is why it is important for us to be involved. This is because without such involvement, then the victim will be the person who, otherwise, would have passed if the Senate had put its stamp on. That is why we are saying that the amendment through this Bill is very good. It is a very good introduction because it will act like a supreme organ such as the High Court or Supreme Court. That is how it is even in the Judiciary where somebody will seek remedy or further hearing in the Supreme Court if he will not be satisfied with the lower court. The same case should be developed in the House.

This House is called Parliament which is made up of two Houses. It is very hard for anybody else out there to know whether it is the National Assembly which has done that job or whether it is the Senate. Now that we have a bicameral Parliament, why do we not give full powers to the bicameral system instead of giving it half-way? When we allow the National Assembly to continue without involving the Senate, the bicameral aspect will, therefore, be missing in the final aspect of such a decision which will have been arrived at by the National Assembly.

I would suggest that we continue with this kind of amendment. It should be appreciated that without the Senate, not much would happen from the National Assembly. We are the people who should be saying how and what the Senate should be doing. We should be able to compare ourselves largely with what happens with the other democracies in the world. We should compare ourselves with America, India, Britain and many others. Some of us have been to these countries and have learnt a lot. The Senate should then be the final House. If anything comes from the National Assembly, it should be seen like it is coming to the final House for decision making because this is a House of records and with very serious Members.

This is a good move and the introduction should not be watered down. It is a spirit towards the right direction and it will harmonise the feeling of both Houses. It is something that should go on record for having been introduced in the first Senate of the Second Republic of Kenya. As we go for the elections, people should get to know that the National Assembly and the Senate work together and that is why we have the bicameral system. It should also be known that we have an understanding that there is nothing that can go undebated by the Senate or can escape the attention of the Senate. This is important and it should emphasize the vital role of a Senate.

We should be comparable to other democracies. If that is the case, we need to assert ourselves in the establishment and it should be entrenched totally so that nobody would be seen as being above the Senate. This is how we will entrench our power in the democracy and in the bicameral Parliament.

In this case, we hail the Senator from Isiolo for having come up with this kind of amendment. I would ask us to compare and see how other countries and democracies have progressed through this kind of introduction. We have benchmarked in other countries and have always asked ourselves why those countries are ahead of Kenya. The most important parameter is the democracy.

Now that we are talking about the legislature and a bicameral Parliament, we should, indeed, have a bicameral Parliament, bicameral activities, bicameral contribution and bicameral characteristics. We should not be seen as being shy when we talk of a bicameral Parliament. What we do should be the same as what happens in India, Korea, Japan, America and other places. When we do that, we will have a progressive country and will be seen like a destination not just in East Africa or Africa, but the world at large.

I support.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I want to start by congratulating my colleague, Sen. Adan, for introducing this crucial Bill and amendment. Throughout this term, we have suffered from ego and not an issue of the letter of the constitution or the spirit. That is what has necessitated this amendment because we have had a ping-pong approach to matters between the Senate and the National Assembly that are unnecessary.

Whenever the Constitution touches on Parliament, it does not require one to be a lawyer to understand or to interpret it to mean Parliament. We have fought this war and we have even gone to the Supreme Court on several matters to seek an advisory opinion and the law has always been on our side. The issue of the vetting of the Inspector General was one issue that brought this ugly face on us. We have always believed that you permanently sit on a position which is not the case.

The treatment we have gotten from the National Assembly as a Senate has been belittling and embarrassing. It is only fair to say that this Senate has worked very hard to maintain the relationship and it has been the sober big brother. However, the nature of the relationship has also necessitated that we touch on a few issues that are of legal nature, including this Bill.

This Bill is a simple amendment. However, it has a lot of weight to the issues that are here. In the nomination of candidates, it gives clear timelines. That is one thing that I like about this Bill. If a Bill originates from the National Assembly, it has to come to the Senate within three days. That will take care of the issue of delaying where we have had cases of a Bill delaying until its time elapses or there is a crisis. It also stipulates that

within three days even after rejection, the nominating authority is communicated to so that they can replace. I am happy with the timelines because sometimes we have seen it happen and cause an unnecessary crisis.

In Clause 7, the Bill provides for the issue of rejection. If you do not reject or approve, it is deemed to have been approved. Even if it is one House – that the National Assembly approves or the Senate does not approve after a few days, that nomination is deemed to have been approved. That is very crucial so that we are also aware that we cannot sit on a nomination and wait forever.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the relationship that we have had with the National Assembly shows that we have not looked beyond our noses. We have had people who have looked just “here, at the nose level”. Of course, this has gone down after they realized their mistake. Perhaps they will find themselves in this House after the next elections. Some of us will be in the National Assembly. I say so because we must make laws that will stand the test of time; for posterity. After 50 years, people will look at the books of history and see that you made a contribution. The statistics in Parliament do not lie. More than 70 per cent of us will not come back. We must drill this into the heads of people who have made sure that they derail the cooperation between the two Houses; from the leadership to the membership.

We must realise that seven out of 10 of us will not come back. That has been proven over time. So, we must make laws considering other people who will be sitting in the positions we are occupying today. If we do that, we will not have issues that we are dealing with every day; the ping pong not only on appointments but even on the passage of Bills. For instance, with the Bill that I sponsored and was signed into law, people were congratulating me that it was signed yet it was a Bill I had authored in 2013. I had to personally follow up to find out where it was stuck in the National Assembly. It is not supposed to be that way. Bills are supposed to have a clear timeline. When a Bill takes such a long time, it should have a self-enactment date; that it is deemed to have been passed. We have Bills that are stuck in the National Assembly, yet we here in the Senate are very good and we fast-track Bills that belong to the National Assembly. This is a very good Bill. I hope that sense has sunk into the heads of the Members of the National Assembly so that they support this amendment without being shortsighted to look at where they sit today.

treated as a second class House of Parliament. We have swallowed that for a long time. However, I hope sense has sunk. We can pass this Bill to unpackage Parliament. The framers of the Constitution were very categorical. They avoided touching on the Senate alone and the National Assembly alone. It was meant to embrace the bicameral structure of Government. Can we have that for our children who will be here 30 or 40 years to come? We should embrace this Bill and pass it.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I congratulate Sen. Adan. With those remarks, I beg to support.

are no drugs or personnel. Some of the governors are not even funding dispensaries in the constituencies.

With the mood that I sense in this Bill, it is important to have an implementation policy committee. I think we have one which should tell us the number of incomplete projects in every county and constituency. This is so that if money is given for it to be completed, there must be a report on the projects that were not completed by the time the Member of Parliament left office and the incoming Member of Parliament should be given money to complete those projects. Otherwise, it will stall forever. That is what this Bill is trying to prevent.

This Bill has come at the right time, more so when we are going for elections. Members of the Senate do not enjoy this kind of monetary benefit like the governors, Members of Parliament and the women representatives who are given money to spend on the various community groups. Since the Senate has not been given anything, people should know that as we go to elections, they should not ask a lot of money from us. They should ask for accountability for the money given to the Members of Parliament, women representatives and governors.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I ask the Senate to support this Bill by Sen.Wangari as it is. We have a serious approach to this issue, because a lot of money has gone down the drain and we are going to avert that situation. The only way to do that is through this Bill.

I beg to second the Bill.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir I congratulate Sen.Wangari for this Bill that she has brought many years late. I do not know whether there is a Bill that she consulted that had been written on the same before. If there is none, then we lost it from the beginning because I am told that in 1963, in Uhuru Park, the late Mzee Jomo Kenyatta announced three things. He said that; from now, we will say “Harambee.” That was meant to assist and build one another and that is the motto for self-help association. We did not capture the spirit of the moment so that we translate this into a law which was to govern whatever was taking place.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I am told that there was a time during either the Eighth or Ninth Parliament that decided to focus on harambee only. They declared that people should not be giving out money but this is what is happening every day. Even as we speak right now, there are very many groups in the villages and rural areas that deal with their own self-help groups.

There is a group called SILK - I do not know its meaning in full. It has now become like a movement. There is another one called Table Banking. It has very many youth and women groups and so on. This is the spirit because such groups put people together in rural areas found in the counties. For that reason, I will ask Sen. Wangari not to propose to anchor this in the national arena because this is a grassroots movement. Part 2 says that there shall be a registrar and deputy registrar that shall be competitively sourced by the Public Service Commission. This should now be left to County Public Service Boards (CPSB) because that is where the real business takes place. It should be

I defer putting of the question as requested by the Mover.

Next order!

Order, hon. Senators. The Clerk-at-the-Table did not realise that the Mover of Order No.17 is ready. So, can you read the next order?

Second Reading

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Self Help Associations Bill (Senate Bill No. 2 of 2015) be read a Second Time.

This Bill is quite critical for one reason. In our country, we have made an impact on groups and organisations; be it Community Based Organisations (CBOs) , Self-Help Associations, women groups, youth groups et cetera. Most of the monies that come from the Government use that channel to be channeled to the communities. We have had a problem. When you register a company, it is done under the Companies Act; when you register a society, it is done under the Societies Act but when you register a self-help association, there is no law or legal framework that governs that registration. The only interaction that the Government has with the groups is when they issue, review or renew a certificate. Therefore, the main role of this Bill is to give a regulatory and registration framework that will help these groups.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, we have about 1.3 million groups in this country which is a large number. If this transformation that has been brought through the huge amounts of monies that have come through the groups can be seen, then we should see proper transformation. We should also monitor whether groups that got monies five years ago are still in existence today. That is not happening. So, the death of groups is higher than the registration. In fact, out of the 1.3 million groups, maybe about 600 are active.

We do not have a register of all the self-help groups in the country. In fact, groups just register to access Uwezo Fund and after that, they close shop. It then loses the meaning and the focus of what groups are supposed to do. Of course, we cannot have all of them active but we need a regulatory framework of capacity building and community development. This is because the Ministry has been charged with that mandate; that you do not just register but you need to make a follow-up to see if that has made a difference in that community.

Monies have come through different organisations like Uwezo Fund which is governed by a Member of Parliament (MP) . If I am an MP, I may just decide that this ward did not vote for me and so I will not pick groups from that ward. Even if I do, who will be the members of that group? I will make X the chairman of this group, Y the secretary and Z the treasurer. In another group, Y is the chairman, Z the treasurer. So, this money will revolve around these people; an elite kind of engagement. That means that the records will show that the money has gone to 30 groups but who are the members of the group? How come you can access money from different groups and no one notices? You will find me in four groups and because I can access or I am the son or daughter of the MP, I will access every Uwezo Fund tranche that comes every year through the four different groups that I am in. That can only be reduced or removed when we make the management of groups to be subject to regulation and scrutiny.

This Bill, therefore, looks at how this has been organised before. Of course, we have the District Social Development Officers (DSDOs) at the county level but they are not enough. We need them to act as registrars of groups. We have looked at this Bill and I have talked to stakeholders. We have also had meetings with the Ministry of Labour and Social Welfare and held many public participation retreats on this Bill. This is a concern for every person that I have talked to. The Ministry, of course, agrees that this has been lacking. However, they have also been skeptical on how we involve counties.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, my argument is very simple. These groups are not in Nairobi but at the counties. So, we must include them in the management of the groups.

That is why I link County Executive Committees (CECs) and you can see the role of the CEC in charge of the county. In fact, even the Council of Governors (CoG) has given its memorandum on the role that they would like to play and which we have looked at as a Committee. I have taken the appointment of registrars to the Public Service Commission (PSC) and I have given the requirements in Part 2 on the appointment of registrars and the registration. I had limited to 40 people in a group but I have since had very interactive sessions with members of the public and they feel that there are some welfare or Community Based Organisations (CBOs) that need to have more than 40 people. So, that is one amendment that we will do and not limit the number of members in a group.

The issue of radicalization also came up during public participation to insulate the groups from misuse by different organizations in doing illegal activities, whether inside or outside the country.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the registrar has been tasked not only to provide model documents and code of conduct for good practice for groups but also to be involved in capacity building. When we give money and we do not educate members of the public on the spending, what it translates to is that we will be in a group of 40 and when we get Kshs40 000, we share it among ourselves. At the end of the day, there is no economic empowerment which is what the groups were meant to do. That is why out of Kshs1.3 Million groups, if a group audit is done, it will be found out that out about 600 are active this year, and a similar number will be registered next year. Therefore, we continue to register new groups without monitoring what the already registered ones have achieved.

We should follow up on the group for the next five years so that we see that in their capacity building, where they were yesterday, they are not there today. Yesterday, we were in State House and I was a panelist in the State House Youth Summit. We were considering the billions of shillings that have been disbursed to groups and companies owned by the youth and women. It will shock you that few groups know that they can access Government Procurement Opportunities certificate (AGPO) and register a business.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, as we boast that we have revolutionalised the issue of community development, if an audit is done, you will be surprised that these groups do not move at all from where they were. There is no meaningful development that can be seen.

Part 4 of the Bill provides for the National Steering Committee on Community Self-Help Development. This is meant to be a linkage between the Ministry and the groups because we do not have anywhere to get the groups’ complaints. The Ministry was defensive that it was doing it but there is a gap. This development has not been felt. We have tried to convince the Ministry on this issue because we feel that if this is replicated at the counties, it will help the groups in terms of management, functioning and regulations.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, this Bill is simple. Some of the amendments proposed through public participation require an insertion of a new part at Third Reading. One of them is on group mobilization, development and management. This is what we borrowed from the Ministry’s experience and from the stakeholders and the practitioners. When there is a conflict in a group, it should be reported in writing to the assistant registrar of the sub-county before it is received at the national level.

The role of the county cannot be over-emphasized. We cannot have groups and exclude the county government and from the Senate point of view, it is not negotiable. We have told the Ministry as much, and I have defended that. We cannot say that because we coordinate groups from Nairobi and few are in Nairobi. Every county must have a role. The County Executive Committee (CECs) members in charge of social development must be involved in that regulation and community mobilization.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, self-help association has been a contentious one. We feel that we will need to call it Group Development and Management. This Bill provides a legal framework to have the groups organised so that they are useful to the people. We cannot continue to pump billions of money without seeing any tangible improvement in terms of their lives. The sector is worth of billions of shillings and it is shocking that it is that big. It can be meaningful if we see success stories from those that have already benefited from it. We must separate the issue of the monies and politicians, I being one of them. I am one of them because when Uwezo Fund and Youth Development Fund are anchored in the Member of Parliament’s office, that MPs will register groups of their supporters so that they can benefit from the monies and deny others who did not support them.

The Temporary Speaker, Sir, we must look at the framework of how we will deal with that issue so that we give every young person, persons with disability and women an opportunity to form a CBO or a welfare group and benefit from these funds. These are not personal monies, but Government funds. We want them to benefit, whether their MP or governor was re-elected or not. That way we would be able to act in the interest of the members of the public.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I request Sen. Karaba to second, and I pray that the Members support this Bill.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I stand to support The Self Help Associations Bill (Senate Bill No.2 of 2015) as moved by Sen. Wangari. What the Senator has said is true. What has been happening in this Parliament is very true with regard to taking stock and audit of what we say in this House and the National Assembly. I was a Member of Parliament of the Ninth Parliament for Kerugoya/Kutus Constituency. Today, it is known as Kirinyaga Central Constituency. During that time when we were Members of Parliament, we drafted quite a number of Bills. One of them was the Constituencies Development Fund (CDF) Bill which went along to help constituencies in terms of development.

The practice has been money is allocated to a certain MP in a given area for development. The MP is supposed to come up with proposed projects which will be funded by the CDF which is established in this House or the “Lower” House. However, when that money is allocated, it belongs to the Member of that constituency. That is why you are finding it is very hard for the Senate to survive because it has no money to operate on its own. However, Members of National Assembly control CDF. Surprisingly, when it was passed, we were not allocated money in the first year of 2003. The first batch came in 2004 which was only Kshs6 million. By the time, the Ninth Parliament was dissolved, we had not even gotten more than Kshs50 million.

Today, an MP is taking to the constituency over Kshs100 million every year while on our part, we only took Kshs50 million to our constituencies in five years. They could even take more as that is the least they could take to the constituency. So, a Member

could craftily say that he has Kshs100 million Fund, another one has Kshs120 million or Kshs150 million or Kshs160 million. It could go up because there are so many other funds that the MPs would like to hold like it is their funds.

That money was given discriminately; it was given to whoever was in a position to influence for more money. Some constituencies are given about Kshs10 million or Kshs20 million depending on how well they negotiate, while other constituencies get nothing.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, what the Senator is articulating is true. We need to account for whatever penny that the Government gives out for any development in the country because if all the monies were to be used properly in every constituency, sub- county and county, we would be talking of a developed country. However, we have some mischievous Members who use that money for campaigns. I am sure that the money that will be allocated to some Members this year will not be used for any development. They will use it strategically to ensure that they are re-elected. They will target regions and people who are opposed to them and their competitors. In essence, this money has been ‘put to waste’ in the sense that it will not go to the intended projects and purpose. That calls for our intervention through this Bill.

Therefore, if this Bill is passed, it will take care of projects that have been neglected and which have stalled because a certain Member of Parliament who came after the other one was not able to complete them or he or she wants to appear like they are the ones who started, funded and completed the projects. There are so many white elephant projects all over. Some projects are half way complete and due to vagaries of weather and climatic changes, they are reduced to nothing, leading to loss of colossal amounts of money.

We should start by introducing the audit which is already captured in the Bill because there are many incomplete projects. For example, I started quite a number of projects, but the Member of Parliament who came after me started his projects. What will happen if the current Member of Parliament is not re-elected in the coming elections? It would mean that whoever will be elected will also start his or her projects. We need to have a clear policy on what the Government should do with some of the projects that were started and are not complete.

Therefore, this Bill should be taken seriously. We should not just talk and do nothing when there is a lot of money going to waste. The custodians of this money are not serious. The Members are only interested in being re-elected on the strength of the money that they have given to these groups. They will make sure that the leaders of these groups are properly funded and compromised, so that come the next elections, they will be singing to the tune of the Member of Parliament or governor.

I would suggest that a fresh audit be conducted with regard to the money which has already been given out to various groups, whether self-help groups or various individuals. Nobody should be allowed to start another project before completing the earlier ones. If the former Member of the National Assembly, Senator or governor is not re-elected into office after his or her term, the successor should continue with the projects that were already started by the former representatives. That is what will make us not to lose more money. In some places, you will find half-done Nyayo wards, but nobody is bothered about them. You will find hospitals that were started by other Members of Parliament that have not been completed. In certain cases, a hospital is complete but there

are no drugs or personnel. Some of the governors are not even funding dispensaries in the constituencies.

With the mood that I sense in this Bill, it is important to have an implementation policy committee. I think we have one which should tell us the number of incomplete projects in every county and constituency. This is so that if money is given for it to be completed, there must be a report on the projects that were not completed by the time the Member of Parliament left office and the incoming Member of Parliament should be given money to complete those projects. Otherwise, it will stall forever. That is what this Bill is trying to prevent.

This Bill has come at the right time, more so when we are going for elections. Members of the Senate do not enjoy this kind of monetary benefit like the governors, Members of Parliament and the women representatives who are given money to spend on the various community groups. Since the Senate has not been given anything, people should know that as we go to elections, they should not ask a lot of money from us. They should ask for accountability for the money given to the Members of Parliament, women representatives and governors.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I ask the Senate to support this Bill by Sen.Wangari as it is. We have a serious approach to this issue, because a lot of money has gone down the drain and we are going to avert that situation. The only way to do that is through this Bill.

I beg to second the Bill.

Hon. Senators, there being no other business on the Order Paper, the Senate stands adjourned until tomorrow, Wednesday, 5th October, 2016, at 2.30 p.m.

The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m.

removed from the national arena except for the regulations that will be used to manage and monitor these groups from the national Treasury.

Having some employee who will lord it over the people in the counties, just like we have had cases of some parastatals cannot assist. If this becomes law, we will see a lot of groups. Villages form a ward and every ward will have this type of movement. Every governor – I cannot see potential governors here – should look at this in order to create a cooperative Bill in their counties. They should set aside not less than Kshs200 million or Kshs500 million per year which will be given as loans to some of the groups because we want to eliminate poverty and make equity the strength of the nation. Because our people are associated with this and they want it to happen, this is very timely. The activity is already taking place but there is no way of managing it.

I ask the Mover to continue looking at this from the perspective of the county. When it is through, we may need to talk to the Council of Governors (CoG) to see how their input could come in. I know a number of governors will be going home next year. We have eight months to go but they would have already contributed. There will be amendments at the Committee of the Whole which will also be addressed during Third Reading.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I support this wholeheartedly and ask my colleagues to also support it.

I now ask the Mover to reply.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I want to start by appreciating the Seconder of the Bill, Sen. Karaba, and Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo for his wisdom. The canvassing of the role of the county governments has actually been an ongoing process. In fact, this Bill was listed on the Order Paper but on request of different stakeholders including the Ministry and the CoG, I stepped it down so that we could engage in a more constructive discussion. We have had submissions of memoranda from the CoG. I totally feel and agree with what Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo has spoken about because this movement is basically at the grassroots level.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I am very appreciative of the process. I hope that this Bill will be supported. To respond to Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, that is why I was saying this Bill is many years late. In fact, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, if you register a company, you register it under the Companies Act but this group had no legal framework under which it is anchored. The Ministry has been developing something but we were able to convince them that this Bill has already taken care of that and that they should put their input to what we already had as a framework so that we can be able to enrich it. I think that is what has happened. We have not agreed on everything but we have reached a consensus on some of the issues that will touch on the third reading.

So, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I want to confirm that I will look at the amendments as we take it to the committee stage.

With those few remarks, I beg to move.

Do you intend we vote or put the question?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg that you defer the putting of the question to tomorrow, pursuant to Standing Order No. 54 (3) .

Okay, I defer putting of the question.

Technology to conduct a countrywide audit on the distribution of teachers in all public schools indicating the requisite establishment per school and the corresponding number of teachers who are in-post and further that the Ministry submits a report to the House on the matter within ninety (90) days.

Hon. Senators, there being no other business on the Order Paper, the Senate stands adjourned until tomorrow, Wednesday, 5th October, 2016, at 2.30 p.m.

The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m.