July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Tuesday, 14th July, 2015

Hon. Senators, I have three messages for you. The first one is a message from the National Assembly on the Presidential Memorandum on the Public Audit Bill, (National Assembly Bill No.38 of 2014) .

Hon. Senators, I wish to report to the Senate that pursuant to Standing Order No.40 (3) and (4) , I have received the following message from the Speaker of the National Assembly regarding the Presidential Memorandum on the Public Audit Bill (National Assembly Bill No.38 of 2014) .

“PURSUANT to the provisions of Standing Order Nos.41 and 142 of the National Assembly, I hereby convey the following message from the National Assembly-

THAT WHEREAS, in exercise of powers conferred on him by Article 115 of the Constitution, His Excellency the President refused to assent to the Public Audit Bill (National Assembly Bill No.38 of 2014) , and referred the Bill to Parliament for reconsideration;

AND WHEREAS, the National Assembly, on Tuesday, June 23, 2015 reconsidered and passed the Bill, fully accommodating the President's reservations and without proposing any amendments to the said reservations;

NOW THEREFORE, in accordance with the provisions of Article 115 (3) and (4) of the Constitution, I hereby forward the memorandum of the President containing his reservations to the Bill, to the Senate for reconsideration."

I thank you.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES APPOINTMENT OF MEMBERS TO THE JOINT COMMITTEE ON THE PRESIDENTIAL MEMORANDUM ON THE PUBLIC AUDIT BILL, 2014 AND THE PUBLIC PROCUREMENT AND ASSET DISPOSAL BILL, 2014

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, we thank you for the messages that you have delivered. On the second two messages, you have clearly given the way forward by appointing Members to the Mediation Committee. However, on the first message on the Public Audit and Asset Disposal Bill (National Assembly No.38 of 2014) , you did not come out clearly. You just read the message and yet Standing Order No.40 (6) says that you may direct the message dealt with forthwith or appoint a day for consideration of the message or refer to the relevant Committee of the Senate. You did none of the three options that are provided on the first message.

Thank you, Sen. Khaniri. You are right. Yes, I did not do what I am expected to do on the first message on the Presidential Memorandum of the Public Audit Bill (National Assembly No.38 of 2014) . This is because I intended, and I combined the Committee in the second message which was the Joint Committee on the Presidential Memorandum on the Public Audit Bill (National Assembly No.38 of 2014)

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I thank you for all those messages. However, I would like to remind you that two weeks ago, I raised an issue concerning a message that this House was expecting from the “Lower House” and you promised that you will make a ruling. This was in connection with the appointment of the Governor of the Central Bank of Kenya (CBK) which was done contrary to the provisions of the Central Bank of Kenya Act, Section 13 (a) which specify that the appointment of the governor and the deputy governor shall be subjected to parliamentary approval and not approval by the National Assembly. I now request for that response from you.

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, I remember you sought that particular statement. I was expecting it to be delivered while I was away, but that did not happen. Therefore, I will deliver it tomorrow afternoon.

Next Order!

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Papers on the Table:-

Report of the Auditor-General on the financial operations of Kakamega County Executive and Kakamega County Assembly for the year ending 30th June, 2014.

Report of the Auditor-General on the financial operations of Nyeri County Executive for the year ended 30th June, 2014.

Report of the Auditor-General on the financial operations of Murang’a County Assembly for the year ended 30th June, 2014.

Report of the Auditor-General on the financial operations of Kirinyaga County Executive for the year ended 30th June, 2014.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I have a Paper that I would wish to lay on the Table even though it is not on the list. Could I proceed and do so?

It is not on the list and you did not put any request until after I had called the next order, but proceed.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Paper on the Table:- Report of the Standing Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget on the Annual 2015 session of the Parliamentary Conference on the World Trade Organisation (WTO) held from 16th to 17th February, 2015, in Geneva, Switzerland.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I know that unless you give permission, I cannot say anything about this conference at this moment. However, there is an item in the Report that is important for us, as a House and a country, as a whole. I wonder whether it is in order for me to mention something on it at this juncture.

Proceed.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The WTO as you know started off by having a parliamentary network with a view of bringing in a legislative framework on world trade, sometime ago. When we went for the conference with two Senators and two clerks, one of the things that came out is that Kenya will be hosting the next Ministerial conference on the WTO in December. The reason this is so important is because this is the first time ever in ten years that there will be a Ministerial conference within the African continent.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Let us take requests for Statements first.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise to demand for a Statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on County Public Accounts and Investments Committee (CPAIC) .

The projects below were launched for commencement by the County Government of Narok during the Financial Year 2013/2014:-

These are: Grading of Eor-Ekule-Sakutiek Road, Siyiapei-Olchoro Road, Enengeetia-Olpusimoru Road and Naroosura-Morijo Road.

Construction of Mulot Bridge to connect the old Mulot Centre with Bomet side of town at Emalo River.

Construction of Olare-Orok Bridge along Olare-Orok Stream at Koiyaki of Maasai region; Naroosura.

Lastly, construction of Enaramatishoreki Bridge at Wuaso-Nyiro River. The questions are as follows:

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, as I listen to Sen. Ntutu, it is clear that these are aspects in that requisition for a Statement concerning accounts which have already been audited. I want to confirm that on Thursday, the County Public Accounts and Investment Committee (CPAIC) will sit to determine the issues for which audit as already been done.

On those ones, we will give the County Government of Narok priority so as to answer the Senator from Narok County expeditiously. However, you need to give further guidance on how we will deal with the issue of the theft that took place this month as CPAIC? Do we refer it to the Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget or you will guide us on it?

All in all, we will give an answer in two weeks.

It is so ordered; in two weeks’ time. You will also look at the issue of the theft at Sekenani Gate. It will be police matters as well, but you will find out where you play a role.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish to request for the following Statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee of Education relating to the management of Moi University and the University of Eldoret both of which have been closed indefinitely. The Chairman of the Committee should inform the Senate on the following:

Sen. Karaba, the Chairman for the Committee on Education?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have heard. I will give the answer in two weeks’ time.

It is so ordered.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, noting the urgency of the matter and the fact that the students were about to do exams, could the Chairman undertake to make the time shorter; say maybe from two weeks to one week.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, these problems have far-reaching consequences. That is why we need two weeks. Exams may be done after the problem has been solved.

Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, I think the Chairman’s request is reasonable under the circumstances. I am sure you expect him to do a good and thorough job. Two weeks is reasonable.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, indeed, I hope that the Chairman will bring the answer not after we have gone for recess. That is my worry; it should be within the stipulated time.

That is a reasonable explanation. It should not be later than the last day of this particular part of the session. We can qualify it that way. Sen. Karaba, the calendar is published so do your own calculations.

Do we have any statements ready to be responded to from the Committee Chairs?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have a statement relating to a request by the Senator for Kirinyaga County, regarding the construction of the proposed Gatitu Nyayo Tea Factory in Kirinyaga County.

The issues were as follows:-

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Please proceed, Sen. Karaba.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for the answer that has been given by my friend, the Senator for Trans Nzoia.

In his answer, he says that the factory was to be established in the Financial Year 2013/2014. I believe that is not true because it was to start when I was still the Director of Nyayo Tea Zone. That was in the year 2004. Therefore, the issue of the tea factory is as old as 2004, when it was supposed to have been constructed together with another factory called Kipchobo Tea Factory in Nandi.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this factory is long overdue. It should have started earlier, but there are delaying tactics coming from the Ministry without proper explanation. Once it is completed, we are aware that it will ease the production of tea estates from Kirinyaga, Meru, Nyeri and some parts of Murang’a counties. This is in line with Vision 2030 Industrialization Programme. I asked this question because the people of Kirinyaga are already aware as they had been promised. I was even supposed to be there with the Minister for Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries for the ground breaking ceremony which never took place.

This is something that should have started earlier and the reasons given cannot stand. Would the Chairman explain when this project will start off, because the ground breaking was supposed to have been done last year? I was there personally---

Order Sen. Karaba! You have made your point. Please proceed, Chairman

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I stand guided by the Senator on the issue of the year of construction. This is because the answer we have here is that the consultants did the design works in 2013 and 2014. The construction was planned to start in the following Finanicial Year 2014/2015. As to when it is going to start, I want to assure the Senator that in this answer, the corporation deems this project as an item of priority. In fact, after the other tea factory in Nandi is finalized, this will be the next one. Construction is intended to start in the Financial Year 2015/2016 subject to the issues that I have alluded to earlier on.

Order, Sen. Karaba! Please proceed, Sen. Ndiema

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I think that I should read again.

Order, Sen. Ndiema! The question is so simple. When?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the corporation targets to start the factory in the Financial Year 2015/2016.

What is it, Sen. Karaba?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the problem here is that we are not getting specifics of what will happen in the Financial Year 2015/2016. The construction works were supposed to have started in the Financial Year 2014/2015. Indeed, some construction work had already begun. However, the delay which was occasioned by the Ministry of Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries is what is causing concern to the people of Kirinyaga. We are worried that it may not start after all. Since, the groundbreaking was to take place, but nobody appeared, we need to know whether it was by design or within the programme.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is not information that I have readily. I would have to seek indulgence, so that I can get specific date when the project will start.

So ordered.

Order, Sen. Karaba! The Chair has been very generous to you. Do not push your luck too far. You need to trust your colleague. He says that he will communicate and give you an appropriate date. If he fails, you still have the liberty of this House to explain that he has failed. For now, let us trust him.

Please, proceed, Sen. Sijeny.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I have a Statement which was sought by Sen. (Dr.) Machage, but he is not in the House. Could you, perhaps, defer it to Thursday?

So deferred to Thursday.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES STATUS OF BOUNDARY SURVEY BETWEEN MERU AND ISIOLO COUNTIES

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I had requested for a Statement from the Chairman of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations on my county’s border dispute with Isiolo County. I know that he has now gotten an improved answer. Is it in order for him to give it to the House?

Order, Sen. Murungi. You are a Member of the Rules and Business Committee (RBC) and you know that we exhaust the listed business first. If there is time, we will indulge you. So, for now the Chairperson is completely not in order.

Let us have the Statements listed. Please, proceed, Sen. Onge’ra.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I sought a statement in May on the effluence in Nairobi Dam. Up to now, I have not received a response. When it came to this House, you directed that it should be issued in 14 days’ time. Now, it is over three weeks since you issued that direction.

Order, Senators! Sen. Ong’era is also a Member of the Rules and Business Committee (RBC) . What I just mentioned to Sen. Kiraitu applies to her.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, my Committee is supposed to deliver a statement sought by Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. I have just mentioned to him that part of it was ready last week and the Chairperson of the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights was ready to deliver it then. Unfortunately he was not around that day. I have tried to trace the response, but I have been unable to pick it. I am sure we can liaise with Sen. Wako’s office and deliver the part that is ready tomorrow.

The other component of this Question relates to the Ministry of Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries. The Chairperson indicated to me that there were discussions between us and the Chairperson of the Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries, so that we find a way of receiving the necessary information from the concerned Ministry. I request the Senator to bear with me so that I bring the part relating to the Director of Public Prosecutions (DPP) and the prosecution tomorrow. The other can be addressed on Thursday, next week.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have no objection. I will take the responses as he has stipulated.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Sen. Khaniri, you should respond to Sen. Ong’era, but that will come later.

I suppose Statement (a) on the Order Paper does not apply for now. So it is deferred.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the Statement that you are just ruling on falls under my Committee. It is listed on the Order Paper appendix as a Statement to be issued. However, I just want to bring to your attention that it has not even been requested. I think it is a mistake that it is to be delivered today.

Really? Okay, we will find out. Sen. Khaniri, it is actually Sen. Munyes to seek a Statement.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, what you have just stated is the right position. However, we all know that what is normally listed in the appendix are the Statements that are due to be delivered and not asked

I agree with you.

Statement (b) on the Order Paper is deferred.

I thought Statement (c) had been responded to unless there was a pending matter.

Let us now indulge Sen. Khaniri on Sen. Onge’era’s Statement.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is true that it has been about two months since the Hon. Senator requested for this Statement from my Committee. We were to get a response from Nairobi County Government and not the Cabinet Secretary (CS) . We wrote to the Nairobi County Government, but we have not received a response, four weeks down the road. We even reminded them two weeks ago.

We have now invoked Article 125 of the Constitution. We have summoned the governor and his team to come and explain this matter to us. I had shared the same with Sen. Ong’era and we are waiting for the governor to appear before the Committee within 14 days.

I think that is self-explanatory, Sen. Ong’era.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES STATUS OF BOUNDARY SURVEY BETWEEN MERU AND ISIOLO COUNTIES

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. It is time for my colleague, the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and International Relations to give the Statement.

Order, Sen. Kiraitu. I avoided whatever you had done because you did it at the wrong time. You can now put your polite request.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, last week the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs brought a statement to this House regarding the boundary dispute between Meru and Isiolo counties, but it was incomplete. It did not address the issues that had been requested for. You ordered the Chairperson to go back and bring us a complete statement. I understand that the statement is ready and I request it be given in the House, so that we test whether it is now complete or not.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. It is true that Sen. Murungi was not satisfied with the statement which was given last week. As a result of that, and following, your ruling, my Vice Chairperson and I visited the Cabinet Secretary (CS) for the Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government. We had very fruitful discussions and he has written a statement to say that the Government is in the process of establishing an administrative boundaries dispute resolutions taskforce. It will comprise officers drawn from the Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government, the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) , the Attorney General, the Ministry of Land, Housing and Urban Development and the National Land Commission. The taskforce will be mandated to address boundary disputes in the country, including that of Isiolo.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, in my earlier request, I had mentioned that we were suspecting that the national Government was refusing to assist in the resolution on the boundary between Meru and Isiolo counties. We had given a very specific programme which had been agreed on between the leadership of Isiolo and Meru counties. The governors of Meru and Isiolo counties would appoint two surveyors each and pay for them. The Office of the President would then provide security for the boundary between the two counties to be marked through GPS. It was as simple as that.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this answer confirms that the Government is actually avoiding marking that boundary because they are now saying that they are going to set up a taskforce whereas we provided the money and the personnel. I am not satisfied that, indeed, the Government is serious about setting up this taskforce. When will the taskforce be formed because they are saying that they are thinking about it?

Secondly, could the Chairperson confirm that once the taskforce is formed, the first boundary that they will mark is the boundary between Meru and Isiolo counties because our process with them had already started?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I listened to the answer given by the Chairperson, and considering that we have quite a number of constituencies which are disputing the boundaries or the counties, I think the approach the Chairperson has talked about is the

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Order, Sen. Mositet! Put your request. This is not a Motion to be debated.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, could that task force also look at the boundary dispute between Makueni and Kajiado counties?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the question of boundary disputes is raging all over the country. As a result of that, the Cabinet Secretary has decided to form a taskforce which will go to all these areas and recommend solutions. As soon as the Cabinet Secretary establishes a taskforce which is already in the process, he intends to present to the Cabinet Security Committee. As soon as it is approved, the taskforce will start their work.

I cannot confirm that Isiolo will be the first on the list. However, I think that is a matter we can discuss with the Cabinet Secretary (CS) as soon as he forms the taskforce.

Chairperson, you said that the formation of the taskforce is already in process, but you have concluded by saying that as soon as the CS forms the taskforce. Which is which?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I said that he is in the process of forming a taskforce and as soon as he completes, he will take it to the Cabinet Security Committee which will approve it. I said after the approval, that is when they will embark on the work.

Are there any timelines?

As soon as possible, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I think it is obvious that the Government does not want to move with speed to resolve these boundary disputes. In our case, we provided the surveyors and the resources. All we wanted was some security supervision for the boundary to be marked through GPS. Could the Chairman tell us why that simple exercise cannot be done even as we wait for the taskforce which, dates when it will be formed are not known?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the dispute is between Isiolo County and Meru counties. It is true that Meru County is prepared to allocate money for the surveyors to do the work, but unfortunately for unknown reasons, Isiolo County is not willing. It is as a result of that, that after our discussion with the Cabinet Secretary that he will form a task force without waiting for any county to decide to follow what was agreed or not and implement the same.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, could I make a simple request that the Chairman and I visit the Cabinet Secretary so that I can hear from the horse’s mouth why he cannot do this very simple exercise which we had agreed on with his predecessor Cabinet Secretary, Ole Lenku? It is even in writing in their files.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Did you hear the Senator for Meru talk about a Cabinet Secretary that does not exist? He mentioned Cabinet Secretary, Ole Lenku. Is he in order to introduce names that are not on the Government payroll?

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Is it in order for the distinguished Senator for Meru to request that this matter remains between him and the Chairman of the Committee when we know that this is a matter that has been laid before the Senate? This is a matter that belongs to this House. The Senator for Meru wants to personalize it between himself and the Chairperson.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Is the Senator for West Pokot in order to mislead this House because we know that when the Cabinet Secretary Nkaiserry was appointed, we have never been told the fate of Ole Lenku? It is possible that Ole Lenku is still a Cabinet Secretary without portfolio.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I do appreciate the position of Sen. Sang that one of our sons is a CS without portfolio since we have never been told that he was sacked. Having listened to Sen. Murnngi that the governors and the leadership of Meru and Isiolo counties had already agreed to make sure that the surveyors were to go to the ground and they were to meet the cost. We also know that within the same counties, there are security personnel and county commissioners in charge of security. Does it mean that those officers in the counties are not capable of carrying out that exercise or what else is it that they need the Cabinet Secretary to do?

Sen. Murungi needs to tell us what kind of security he is talking about.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, what transpired between the Senator for Meru and the Chairman of the Committee leaves some of us more confused than before. We are yet to find out whether when we have similar problems we need to sort it out between ourselves or it is something which will be adopted by the whole House? I thought that when there is a boundary dispute, there should be a common approach to the problem.

Mr. Chairman, although the request from Sen. Murungi was really mild, you should give it an attempt given the other related interventions.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, from the discussions that we had with the Cabinet Secretary, I want to assure Sen. Murungi that the matter at hand is being handled through a taskforce that was formed. It is very difficult to resist a request of somebody like my friend, Sen. Murungi. However, to be very sincere, it will be useless to make statements if after every statement the Chairman follows a Member who requested for a statement to the CS to discuss the matter further.

To answer Sen. Mositet and Senator---

Mr. Chairman, I thought you could add that in your circumstance last time, your Vice Chairperson requested you to accompany her.

Yes, Mr. Speaker, Sir, then, you ordered so. Mr. Speaker, Sir, to answer Sen. Karaba and Sen. Mositet, after the formation of the taskforce, the dispute about boundaries all over the country will be resolved when we meet. There is no discussion between me and Sen. Murungi regarding the matter. When I was presented with the statement, I decided that the taskforce would deal with all boundary disputes in the country. So, we should take that one first.

Order, hon. Senators! I think we have done very well on this particular Order. I do not want us to spend a lot of time on it. However, I find

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, last Thursday, you directed the Chairman of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations to bring an answer to a statement that I requested regarding the killings that took place in Mt. Elgon. He has confirmed to me that he has the answer with him.

Order, Senator! I will not entertain the business of ambushing the Chair. The House must be predictable and move within allocated time. You should have approached me first so that I know about that. I would not have entertained the other interventions if I knew that another statement was forthcoming. Since you have put the request – many a time, Chairs claim that statements are not ready

Mr. Speaker, Sir,

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I thank the Chairman for bringing answers regarding what I had requested. However, his answers do not add up properly. They do not respond to questions that I sought. The allegations were that the two boys were herding cattle in the forest. He has now changed the story and referred to them as bandits.

Secondly, he also claims, in the answer, that when the two boys were killed, a magazine and some bullets were collected next to their dead bodies. He has not told us whether the gun was recovered because you cannot get a magazine of bullets without a gun. We need that to come out clearly because it is likely that somebody placed that magazine next to the dead bodies, to appear as though those people were bandits.

Lastly, 16th April, 2015 is about three months ago and when we met the Director of Public Prosecutions (DPP) last week he said that no file had been forwarded to him. Could the Chairman clarify those issues, so that the officers who killed these boys can be brought to book?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the statement that has been given is not satisfactory. This is because we had raised several issues other than what Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo had raised. We had sought to know what the policy of Kenya Wildlife

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Order, Senator! You must have raised all the issues then. You just need to seek clarifications now.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, we have not gotten all the answers as we had asked. We have been told that the file has been forwarded to the DPP. What is the file all about? Does it say that some KWS rangers did actually commit an offence and, therefore, they need the DPP to prosecute or what is it all about? It is true that we met the DPP---

Order, Senator! You are not getting it. Please, seek clarifications.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, could the Chairman seek to find out whether, indeed, the file has been forwarded to the DPP, because he confirmed to us in the Committee that the file has not reached them? Could he also confirm that these two boys were actually grazing their animals and had milk, which the rangers themselves drank? Could he further confirm that the boys were not armed? Indeed, they were not armed and just executed.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I think what we are dealing here with is hearsay. According to the KWS, when the three were confronted there was an exchange of fire. In the process, unfortunately, two of them died. A magazine with bullets was recovered and one of the poachers ran away. We can only imagine that he ran away with the gun. I do not know what to say other than that.

Regarding the file being sent to the DPP, only last week together with Sen. Obure, we were with the DPP, investigating the case in Kinna. He told us that he only saw the file after we had invited him to come before us. He indicated that the file was being handled by other officers. The DDP’s office has so many officers and so, it is possible that one officer might have seen it while another has not seen it.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I request that the Committee gives an undertaking to go and unravel the whole drama surrounding these killings by visiting Mt. Elgon, because there issues which do not add up. We are saying that these were herdsmen and the Chairman is calling them bandits. He also says that they were killed and a magazine recovered, but no gun was found. Now he has gone further to say that the third person may have run away with the gun. If they were bandits then each of them would have been armed with whatever type of weapon. Now that the Senate is the last hope for the people of Mt. Elgon, and that is why they raised this issue, could the Chairman and the Committee go and do further investigations on the ground and report to us?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I support that proposal and request that the Committee takes it up in the same manner that it is investigating the matter concerning Kinna.

Order, Senators! I think the Chair agrees with the two Senators. Where the two Senators are in total disagreement with the Statement the best action to take is for you, as a Committee, to make a finding either by inviting the

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, without the Senators asking and Sen. Obure is my witness; we summoned the Director of KWS and raised this issue with him this morning. In future, instead of us directing this kind of request for a statement to the Cabinet Secretary, Ministry of Internal Security and Coordination of National Government, it should go to the relevant departments and services. This is because the Director of KWS told us that he was not asked about this issue. So, this statement could not have come from the KWS. I have asked him to write to us, explaining what transpired. As soon as he does that and we are satisfied we shall inform my colleagues. If we will not be satisfied, we will take the action that you have recommended.

Thank you.

It is so ordered.

Hon. Senators, I have a brief Communication to make at this particular moment. It relates to the appearance by the Cabinet Secretary for Education before the Committee of the Senate on Education.

The Cabinet Secretary will appear tomorrow at 10.00 a.m. in this Senate Chamber to respond to the request for a Statement on the predicament of students of the Garissa Teachers Training College resulting from insecurity.

The hon. Senators will recall that the matter of insecurity in the various parts of the country and in particular, the three counties of the former North Eastern region, namely Mandera, Wajir and Garissa counties and the plight of teachers who are teaching in these areas as well as the students who are affected by the absence of teachers, elicited a lot of interest and concern in Senate.

This is, therefore, to invite all Senators to attend the Committee meeting here in this Chamber tomorrow at 10.00 a.m.

I thank you. Next Order!

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Who had the Floor? I gather that it is Sen. Sang. He has a balance of 45 minutes.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I moved this Bill. However, just to refresh our memories, this is the County Hall of Fame Bill (Senate Bill No.33 of 2014) . It seeks to establish a legal framework that allows county governments to honour the heroes and heroines who have made exceptional contributions in the counties.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Bw. Spika wa Muda, asante kwa kunipa nafasi hii niunge mkono Mswada huu. Pia ninataka kumpongeza Seneta kijana shupavu, wakili ambaye ni Seneta wa Nandi, Sen. Sang. Ni jambo la muhimu kwake kuleta Mswada huu. Kwa mara ya kwanza tangu tupate Uhuru, tunaona mwelekeo hasa katika Serikali zetu za ugatuzi. Hii imekuwa changamoto hasa tukiangalia wakati huu ambapo tumepoteza mtu shupavu nchini. Huyu ni mtu ambaye tangu Kenya ipate Uhuru, amekuwa akichekesha watu, amekuwa akichekesha taifa nzima katika kipindi kinachoitwa Vitimbi. Huyu ni Mzee Ojwang.

Hivi sasa sisi sote tunaomboleza kama taifa kwa kumpoteza Mzee Ojwang. Yeye alikuwa anajulikana hata na watoto wachanga. Sisi wenyewe tumekuwa tukimtazama huyu mzee katika televisheni akichekesha wananchi. Hivi leo ni jambo la aibu kwamba mzee kama huyu amekufa kama mtu ambaye hakuwa anajivunia kuwa Mkenya.

Hakuna mtu yeyote ambaye anaweza kusema kwamba Serikali ilimjengea nyumba, kumfanyia jambo fulani ama kumtambua tu kwa sababu ya vitimbi vyake kwa miaka 30. Tunasema kwamba hili ni jambo la aibu. Inatakikana wakati mtu akifanya kitu chema kama vichekesho ama usaidizi kwa Wakenya, ni lazima taifa letu liweze kumtambua.

Hivi sasa tunasema kwamba Mwenyezi Mungu amuweke Mzee Ojwang mahali pema peponi. Wananchi wakati huu ni lazima waelewe kwamba sisi kama Seneti tumeona kwamba Mswada huu ni muhimu kwa wale ambao wametoa maisha yao kusaidia nchi au Serikali.

Tunajua kwamba jambo kama hili, kumekuwa na mapendeleo, kujuana na njia tofauti tofauti ama mbinu ambazo watu wanatumia kupata shahada kama hizi zinazotolewa na Serikali kuu. Kuna EGH, OBS na kadhalika. Watu wamekuwa wakizipeleka kwa jinzia ya urafiki na kwa kujulikana ili kutambuliwa na Serikali kuu. Sasa wakati umefika wa kaunti kupewa uwezo wa kutambua watu ambao wamefanya vitu ama waliotenda vitendo ambavyo viliweza kusaidia kaunti ambazo walitoka.

Tunajua wahenga walisema ya kwamba mwacha mila ni mtumwa. Ikiwa wewe umeishi katika ulimwengu na umewacha asili yako, unafanya vitu vya kizungu, umeendelea ama umesoma na hutaki asilia yako, basi wewe ni mtumwa.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. The Senator, while contributing, kept on using the word Vigango. I am sure myself and many other Kenyans may not understand what he meant. He has just mentioned that it means artifacts and I think that was important.

Are you saying that you want him to expound on it?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I stood on a point of order to request the Senator to explain what vigango means, so that Kenyans may know and follow him on this important contribution.

Bw. Spika wa Muda, vigango ni kama vidonga. Ni vitu ambavyo ni vya zamani za kale. Kama sanamu za Koitalel arap Samoei ambazo zilichongwa,

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I rise to support this Bill and congratulate the Mover, Sen. Sang, whom we had the pleasure of hosting as a Committee to take us through this Bill. I must say that it is well thought out.

Article 11 of the Constitution recognizes culture as the foundation of the nation and as the cumulative civilization of the people of Kenya and nation. We have had an administration where these commendations, recognition of talent or honours were bestowed to the state. It has not been easy for 40 million people to be rated by one committee. There have been issues and we have always wondered who the people given commendations are, yet we have real heroes whom we think should get but are left out.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, if there is a group of people who should get commendation, it is the national volleyball team of this country; our girls, who are called

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I also rise to support this Bill which comes at a very interesting time. It is true that different counties have different priorities in terms of economic and socio-cultural priorities. What speaks to, touches or is important to the people of one county may not necessarily speak to, touch or be important to the people of another county. It is only right and intelligent that the County Hall of Fame Bill (Senate Bill No. 33 of 2014) be left at the county level. This is because it is the people of that county who know who has done what in that community.

There are unique counties like Nairobi, Mombasa, Kisumu and Nakuru where there is a convergence of cultures and the entire strata of the middle to high class. What will be communicated and appreciated, for example, by the people of Nairobi could probably be somebody who will come up with a lasting solution to the perennial traffic jam or the garbage issue. These kinds of issues will not be appreciated in a county like Turkana or West Pokot where they do not as yet experience these problems. It is only proper that those who make the contribution in Nairobi County be left to its people to choose.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Allow me to laud the Senator for Nandi for this very timely, thoughtful and well thought out Bill. Allow me to also encourage that adverse ruling that came from the High Court should not stop him there. You should study the ruling of the High Court so that we see how we can incorporate the criticism that was made by the Bench so as to enable that Board to continue. This is because whether we like it or not, we must create a forum whereby leadership can come and reflect on the projects and programmes of development in a county.

This Bill is a coming at a time when just a few months ago I addressed the County Assembly of Kakamega. I spent quite a bit of time talking about the need for us to immortalize our heroes. I told the Assembly that when I remember the late Joseph Martin Shikuku as one of the people who fought for the second liberation of this country and

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Order Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. I am not Madam Speaker.

Sorry, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. In fact on the lighter side – forgive me for that – there is something going on on social media that there is notice of a demonstration in Nairobi of 5,000 people on 23rd who will be moving in our streets stark naked. They want to make a statement that people who doubt one’s sex can see on that day. So, these things are there. How amazing Nairobi will be.

The people of Vihiga County can use this opportunity---

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Is Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale in order to suggest that for him to establish your gender that you might need to be one of those people who will be in that rally so that he can confirm anything?

He is completely out of order.

Thank you. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for making that ruling. I will tell you how the gender of a Luhya boy is determined. It is determined during circumcision whether you are either a man or a woman or transgender. You are treated differently during circumcision.

The people of this country might want to remember that somebody invented Mpesa. How come a Kenyan invented Mpesa, he earns no royalties, nobody cares to even just recognize him and this has become the “in” thing. In fact, I was talking to an economist who told me that, to him, 20 years from now, all money in the world is going to be mobile. Which politician would want his Kshs100, 000 to sit in a bank in Barclays and you have to go there, you have to write a cheque and you know all the stories? When it is in your mobile account, you can use it as and when you need it. These are the great brains that we have in this country.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the people of Busia County might want to be remembered for the boy who invented Boda Boda. Boda Boda was invented by a boy who realized that you could take soap – soap was only being manufactured in Kenya – to Busia Uganda and come back with beans. This was treated as contraband in those bad days the economy of Uganda was not doing very well. It then got on and on, and I remember in 2003 when I congratulated the Boda Boda invention, Members of Parliament from certain parts of this country mocked and laughed at me; look at you people, you are so poor that you transport people on bicycles. How nice it is that today, Boda Boda is the main transport in the entire Republic of Kenya and it is the answer to unemployment to very many Kenyan youth.

In Clause 16, we are being told that the governor can remove somebody posthumously. The Mover should not go that route because many of the beneficiaries will be politicians and they will be leaving a certain legacy. For example, if by happenstance and by good luck I was to make my way into the hall of fame, in Kakamega County, something which I highly doubt because sometimes I see the recipients of presidential

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Is the Senator for Kakamega in order to say that he does not support his daughters being politicians while we know that he himself is a politician and there is a Constitution which he has sworn to protect so that every gender is given the same opportunity?

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, are you in order to insinuate that the reason for which you do not support your daughter to be a politician, is because on the contrary, you want them to be good wives and, therefore, by implication, female politicians do not make good wives? You are completely out of order because female politicians are very good wives.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I withdraw and replace the words with what I actually meant. It was a slip of the tongue. What I meant is that young Halima was a classmate of my daughter, Cincy, at the university. So, she is trying to amuse Cincy wherever she is watching television. Concerning the serious point that you have raised, I withdraw. I meant good cooks. It is very difficult for a wife who is a politician to have time to be a good cook.

Order, Senator. You are completely out of order. Female Senators are very good wives and cooks. Since you cannot table anything substantial on the Floor of this Senate – you have not given all these female Senators the opportunity to cook for you in order to advise or ascertain whether they are good or not – you are completely out of order. You must withdraw and apologise.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I am very sorry for that. I withdraw and apologise. However, I blame it entirely on my colleague, Sen. Mugo, who once cooked githeri which smelled of smoke and nobody could eat it at home.

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, take your seat.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. Is Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale in order to insinuate that---. Could he substantiate that Sen. Mohamud has made a contribution in this august House for amusement of someone watching the television somewhere at home? Is that in order?

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, you are completely out of order for even mentioning Sen. Mugo adversely.

Sen. Mugo, I can see that you have logged in.

Madam Temporary Speaker, could the Senator for Kakamega County substantiate where I cooked githeri and it smelled of smoke? He should withdraw and apologise for that. For his information, I am a very good cook and legislator.

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, you should withdraw and apologise all the comments that you have made. You are completely out of order.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I completely withdraw and apologise. However, Sen. Mugo’s brother, Prof. John Mugo, was my lecturer of biochemistry. He taught me and told me about her weaknesses.

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, you are completely out of order.

Madam Temporary Speaker, we should not allow a Senator to impute improper motive on another Senator by saying she does not know how to cook. This is being broadcast live. I know that Sen. Mugo is one person who carries herself very well. She has kept her marriage and she is very good in looking after her family. Therefore, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale is out of order. Could he apologise and withdraw?

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, you were completely out of order. Could you apologise once more to Sen. Mugo?

Madam Temporary Speaker, apparently, Sen. Mugo was very happy when I reported that her own brother, Prof. Mugo, taught me biochemistry. There are some of the things that he leaked to me. However, I apologise and I have withdrawn.

Order, Senator. We cannot discuss here what Sen. Mugo’s brother told you 50 years ago while you were still students. Could you also withdraw that one and apologise? Thereafter, you should conclude your contribution.

Madam Temporary Speaker, in conclusion, after withdrawing and apologising, I want to talk about the role of cultural heroes. This gives us a big opportunity for people from different cultures to appreciate their heroes. For example, in my community, we have traditional circumcisers who are very unique. There is no way you can immortalise them. I see an opportunity especially in counties like Kakamega and Bungoma and sections of Vihiga and Tiriki where we have cultural heroes. In our culture, we have two heroes who are the kings of isukuti playing. These are

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker for giving me this opportunity so that I also contribute to this Bill. Like other Senators who have spoken before me, I would like to congratulate the Mover for bringing a very timely Bill into this House which is about honouring our heroes who struggled for freedom and justice to our land.

Madam Temporary Speaker, in the preamble to the Constitution, the second and third paragraphs of the preamble, if I may quote, says that:-

“HONOURING those who heroically struggled to bring freedom and justice to our land:

PROUD of our ethnic, cultural and religious diversity, and determined to live in peace and unity in one indivisible sovereign nation:”

Madam Temporary Speaker, the reason why I looked at this preamble was to link it to the fact that for the very first time in this country, we will devolve our culture and heritage and reward our unsung heroes and heroines in our counties; a thing that has never happened in this country.

Madam Temporary Speaker, should this Bill be assented to, it will mean that for the very first time, we shall award and induct many of our heroes and heroines at the grassroots. If that happens, we will make them our unsung heroes and heroines who many times we have ignored.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I want to go to the depths of this Bill. I want to look at Clause 6 of the Bill. I support the suggestion by the distinguished Senator for Kakamega County. We may need to consider changing the composition. I persuade the Mover to think about what the Senator proposed. We should not leave such an important task to the deputy governor and the county executive committee. We should consider the fact that the governor could be the chairperson. The Senator and Members of Parliament (MPs) ; both nominated and elected, should also be part of the composition.

Madam Temporary Speaker, Clause 7 of this Bill outlines the functions of the selection committee. I am very glad that the Bill has set out areas in which the selection committee should receive recommendations from various interests. I persuade the Mover to consider the issue of public participation at the grassroots which you talked about. There could be people with special interests from the counties or minority groups whose interests may not be considered. A provision should be set in so that public participation about who eventually should be heroes or heroines is taken care of. That way, we will avoid the practice of nepotism and issues of corruption.

Madam Temporary Speaker, Clause 11 outlines who may become a hero or heroine. I am very happy that issues of exemplary qualifications have been stated. For a person to qualify, he or she should be somebody who has had outstanding achievements. That makes me think about many unsung heroes especially in the Kisii Community. These include people like Nyantika Mayiora, Otenyo Nyaigoti and Moraa Nyangiti who

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for allowing me to join my colleagues in thanking Sen. Sang for bringing yet another very important Bill that seeks to make devolution meaningful, as envisaged in the Constitution.

Madam Temporary Speaker, as we know, up to now, recognition of various contributions to society has only been at the national level. By nature of it, this has been lopsided and I do not think that all communities or regions have benefited from recognition. The heroes and heroines of this country date back to historical times. We can talk about the pre-colonial era where we had heroes in communities.

Communities did not just come into existence after the colonialists came. Of course, they came and there are those heroes who fought hard to resist domination and

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Madam Temporary Speaker, on the outset, I thank the Mover of the Bill for moving this important Bill. I support it. I had the opportunity to look at this Bill because I sit in the Committee on Labour and Social Welfare where we conducted public participation and hearing. It is a good Bill.

There are various heroes and heroines from different counties who are not recognised both at the national and county levels. For example, in the Somali Community, we have an old man by the name Mohammed Noor Ali. He is famously known as Mzee Ma Noor. At the age of 40 years, he became a councillor. In addition, he was a freedom fighter from the northern part of the country. He was detained together with the first President Jomo Kenyatta. To some extent, he was honoured by the first President of this Republic.

To my dismay, last month Mzee who is currently 80 years old, visited the immigrations office to get a passport to go to the Haji and perform his religious duties: It took him almost a month to get a passport. He is a true patriot who fought for the Independence of this country. So, it was not fair to treat him in that way.

In Mandera County, in the last incident of a terror attack where 14 people were massacred, there was a 22 year old lady; a wife of the owner of the house where the

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to speak about this Bill. I thank the Mover of the Bill, Sen. Sang. There are people who assume that I am the youngest elected Senator in this House but credit goes to Sen. Sang. Over the years, he has proven that young Senators are also capable of doing a splendid job. I congratulate him on that.

As I speak about this Bill, allow me to pay tribute to the late comedian, Mzee Ojwang. Many of us cannot recall any other name besides Ojwang Hatari. He is one of those heroes that if this Bill would have become an Act while they were still alive, he would have ended up in the one of the halls of fame that we will be setting up across the country.

Allow me also to congratulate the Kenya Volley Ball Team. The ladies have done us proud. What we keep on forgetting is that this is not the first time that they have clinched a major title. When they come back to Kenya, we will, probably, go and meet them just for the sake of getting good photos for social media rather than meaning well for their welfare as a team. I urge those who will welcome and host these fair ladies to dinners, ballads and dances to have their interests at heart and not just try to milk publicity through our usual social media strategies.

Madam Temporary Speaker, the intention of this Bill is great because it intends to recognise heroes at the local level. We have relied on national recognition schemes to identify and recognise our heroes. Unfortunately, these schemes have a very limited view of the nation. We have seen that, mostly, it is politicians, public administrators, military, police officers and chiefs who have benefited from the national recognition schemes.

There have been accusations of nepotism, tribalism and political patronage in the award of national recognition schemes. It is a good thing that with devolved system of government, we are pushing the recognition to the local levels so that we do not have that monopoly of recognition being left at the national level.

This Bill does not mean that the national recognition schemes that are run by the head of State will come to an end. However, at least, at the local level, the halls of fame will talk about our local heroes and ensure that we immortalize them. Besides setting up a whole of fame, there are other approaches that have been used to recognise our heroes.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Your time is up.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I want to join my colleagues in congratulating and thanking Sen. Sang and the entire Committee that worked to make sure that this Bill comes at such a time when we are beginning to put down the foundation for devolution, teaching our children and grandchildren where the counties begun. Therefore, it requires guidance and a law that is going to remind us

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Your time is up, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo.

Please proceed, Sen. Wambui Beth Mugo.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for remembering my other name.

I rise to support this Bill and thank the Mover, Sen. Sang, for thinking about it. I believe this Bill will play a major role in creating or writing the history of our country.

A people without a history cannot be a nation. As we look back, we have very little history. This is because, it is people who make history and because we do not have a lot of written history in our country about heroes, events and things that took place in our country before we got to where we are today, I would say that there is a vacuum. I hope that the hall of fame will fill that vacuum, because it would be impossible to put all

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

On a point of information Madam Temporary Speaker.

Sen. Mugo, do you wish to be informed by Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo?

Madam Temporary Speaker, I do.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I wish to inform my colleague, Sen. Mugo, that from the history books we read that Wangu wa Makeri was a very powerful woman who “sat” on every man around her. Is that why her name has refused to appear anywhere? It could be.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Madam Temporary Speaker, is that why men are afraid to honour her? Yes, she had to assert herself and I am glad she is in the history books. However, we also want to see her and others on the hall of fame. Thank you for the information.

Let me reiterate that we should not complain about everything because we have not stopped developing institutions. I do not think those who have been named after institutions or roads named themselves. It is the people who were there at that time who decided that we will name this after this person because of the contributions that they have made. We should appreciate that. We have many roads like Argwings Kodhek, Tom Mboya – a major road – and Ronald Ngala.

Madam Temporary Speaker, when you mention the founding father of this country, sometimes I feel sad because it is like belittling the contribution that he made. It is part of our history and it does not mean others did not make the history either. I hope that we will not look at these things and personalize them but we will view them as tangible contributions which create the history of our country. I hope that it will all be written one day and even many other heroes who have not been featured will be featured with time.

I also hope that we shall name something after the immediate former President, Mr. Kibaki, who contributed a lot. Nothing was named after him when he was President but it does not mean he cannot be named after one of the many institutions which are coming up. It is not a crime but part of our history. We cannot erase but build on history.

Madam Temporary Speaker, as I congratulate the author of this Bill, I appeal to counties that they will research and make documentation of who should be honoured and why. They should not be discriminative but inclusive of all those who have contributed. We also have young men and women who have excelled in sports. We hope to see them too on the hall of fame.

I support the Bill strongly and it does not take away anything from National Honours. It just adds.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I would like to support the County Hall of Fame Bill (Senate Bill No. 33 of 2014) , which has been brought to the Floor of this House by Sen. Sang. This is a very important Bill as it seeks to provide a framework for the recognition of persons who have made significant contribution to the county or our country.

We know that in the past, people have been recognised at the national level and counties have been forgotten. I say so because of devolution. We have devolved governance to counties and, therefore, we have to give them autonomy to choose persons of integrity who have contributed greatly to this country in different forms. For instance, in my county, Trans Nzoia, we have a man called Elijah Wanameme. He was a great man and people idolized him. He passed on but what he said came true. We also have many who died like Matungulu who was a great musician. After you are buried, people forget you.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I would also propose that we should rewrite the history of great people in the counties and, may be, name them after schools and universities just the way we have Masinde Muliro University of Science and Technology.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I thank Sen. Sang for this important Bill that tackles culture and heritage which is very critical in our country. This is an area which has been ignored especially when we compare with the western countries where independence days are marked as national holidays. Towns are full of statutes and history about histories right from the pre-civilization time. It is really quite an honour for their families.

This Bill intends to do that for us in a devolved system which is critical for us because the basis of values and morals can go to the county level and not necessarily remain at the national level. Not that it is a bad thing, but it also gives more people a chance to be honoured. It is good that this Bill gives criteria for that process by forming a hall of fame selection committee that should be able to come up with rules on how to do the selection. This is clearly stipulated in the Bill so that at the end of the day, it is clear who should be chosen into this list. I know there is going to be a lot of competition and many people will feel that there are certain persons whose names have been omitted from the list. Criteria should, therefore, be well stipulated.

Madam Temporary Speaker, there is also criteria for registration, documentation, information, items and preservations that are going to be put there so that we do not have somebody sneaking in a name without a specific formula being followed.

Public participation has also been taken into consideration at Clause 13 (2) ; there are going to be written submissions across all stages. People are going to participate to ensure that the right names are given. For us, the Mijikenda, we would not want Mekatilili wa Menza to be forgotten. She was a Mijikenda woman from the Giriama Community who became a hero of her time when very few women were able to come out and fight for Independence. We honour Mekatilili and she is one of the persons who I know for Kilifi County will definitely be considered.

People like Ronald Ngala who fought for Independence of this country is also another person from the coast region who should not be forgotten to be honoured. People like Timothy Ramtu from Kwale County are also important people because they headed some of the first commissions that were very critical for this country. There is also Chingoro Stephen Zani who was one of the first people within the Digo community to start the Anglican Church among many other people from the coast region.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I think setting up the criteria for nomination is very important. There is also the aspect of being able to come up with a petition for those who feel that they have been unjustly left out or have people they think should have been included but have been left out.

Another important aspect of the Bill is at Article 19 (c) that puts a penalty for liability of those who pretend to be members of the hall of fame and yet they are not there has been put into consideration.

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

Thank you, Senator. I now call upon the Mover to reply.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I wish, at this point, to thank Senators who have contributed to this Bill. I also appreciate the very valid and immense contributions that they have made to this Bill. I thank Sen. Madzayo for seconding the Bill. I know that his Committee has developed a number of amendments that will address a number of concerns that were raised by Members. I appreciate contributions from all Senators. Some of them have specifically given examples of the very many heroes and heroines that we need to recognise.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I know that even in biblical terms – this is very common in Kenya – that a prophet is not honoured at home. We rarely recognise our

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

July 14th, 2015 SENATE DEBATES

The request is granted. We will put the Question next week on Wednesday, at 2.30 p.m.

Hon. Senators, it is now time to interrupt the business of the Senate. The Senate stands adjourned until tomorrow, Wednesday 15th July, 2015, at 2.30 p.m.

The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m.