November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Tuesday, 10th November, 2015

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise under Standing Order No.45 (2) (b) to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Committee on Labour, Social Welfare and Health concerning the death of a pregnant mother by the name of Elizabeth Akala. She was born in Kakamega County and married in Vihiga County. The death occurred last week at the Kakamega Level 5 Referral Hospital.

In the statement, I would like the Chairperson to clarify the following issues:-

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The Committee from which Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale seeks that statement does not exist. We do not have a Committee on Health, Social Affairs and Labour.

That is correct.

My apologies, Mr. Speaker, Sir. My secretary must have used the old Standing Orders when she was typing the statement.

Order, Senator. You do not take away responsibility from yourself. That is only but your agent who is not known in this House.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I, therefore, wish to apologise for the typographical error and request that my request proceeds. In the view of the unique circumstances---

Order! You already elaborated the circumstances. The issue at hand here is which Committee the statement should be directed to.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I request that the matter be referred to the right Committee, in this case, the Departmental Committee of the Senate on Health.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not know whether you will allow me to ride on the statement.

Proceed, as long as it is relevant to it.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the case of Elizabeth Akala is very sad. I know she was buried last Saturday in my county. Unfortunately, I did not make it to attend the burial, my condolences to the family. I hope that God rests her soul in peace.

It is unfortunate that this is coming just after we buried one Alex Madaga---

Order, Sen. Khaniri. I thought you wanted a further request to the statement, not making your own submissions.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am building my case.

Can you do it quickly?

I will do it very quickly. Give me one minute, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I will be done. This is similar to Mr. Alex Madaga’s case who died under similar circumstances. I sought for a statement here from the same Committee you have directed the Senator to direct the statement to. Up to now, the statement has not come even after you further directed that the statement be made by the Senate Deputy Leader of Majority.

This is a clear case of professional negligence. It is sad that it is happening to residents of my county. Not that I wish it to happen to any Kenyan. It is sad that two cases have happened in my county, one after the other. What action will the Government take in terms of compensating the two families? These individuals died in Government institutions due to professional negligence. The families are entitled to compensation.

Is the Chairperson, Committee on Health, present? Is the Vice Chairperson or any other Member of the Committee here?

Yes, Sen. (Dr.) Machage, now that it has been clarified.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to make this statement before I give a date of response. It might not be prudent for us to blame the medical personnel at this time. Let us investigate---

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Machage. You know the rules of this House.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am trying to give half an answer.

You cannot give half an answer.

I do not want half!

You either give a whole answer or no answer, at least for now.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, two weeks should be enough to investigate the matter. But I think it is preeclampsia which has nothing to do with medical personnel.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. We heard both of you. You will have another opportunity to interrogate that matter when it comes to the House.

Let us proceed.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. This is very serious.

I hope this is not a case of two doctors disagreeing.

No, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Lawyers have disagreed here severally and you have allowed them.

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. I think I had already ordered Sen. (Dr.) Machage, that in the statement, he must include all those facts.

Next Statement by Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am requesting for two statements.

First, I commend the people living along the areas where cattle rustling had been rampant for years. All the way from Baragoi in Samburu and Turkana East, running to my county, Nauyapong’ and Loringiping in Turkana West. For almost six months now, we have had relative calm and peace. I commend the people who live around the border, for genuinely among themselves, even without serious support from the national Government, choosing to work towards the path peace.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Proceed.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I also rise pursuant to Standing Order No.45 (2) (b) to seek a Statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations, regarding the break in, on 11th October night, 2015 at the Kapenguria CDF building, which houses Kapenguria Constituency Office, the Ministry of lands and Ministry of Culture and Tourism for the County Government of West Pokot. In the statement, the chairperson should:

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I thank Sen. Lonyang’apuo for coming up with that statement. I just want to give him a rider on that; it was North Rift leaders, where he comes from, that are the grand leaders of the Pokot and Turkana. Peace has prevailed in that area since we started the peace initiative.

I would like on that one, to ask the chairperson; what has happened to the promise they gave to those leaders to facilitate them to ensure peace prevails in that area and form a cattle rustling unit of the police.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I request to be given two weeks to respond to those statements.

It is so directed. Including what Sen. Leshore has added in terms of the entire North Rift initiative and the special unit.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, allow me to seek a statement or a directive from you. Most of these statements have been appearing in the Order Paper for the last one to six months. So, I have been thinking that the people who are supposed to reply are either lazy, incompetent or corrupt. How can statements lie on their table for the last six months?

Order, Senator! There is no basis on which you can seek a statement from me. You can only rise on a point of order after failure to get responses to the statements listed.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES INSECURITY ALONG THE MERU-ISIOLO BORDER

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not have this statement, however, I will follow up and by tomorrow, we might have the answer.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the statement had been given last week by Sen. Haji. However, there were certain clarifications which he said he would go back to the Cabinet Secretary to seek, and come back with this week. So, since he is not here, it is only fair that we allow him to arrive. If he arrives before you finish this Order, then he can make that statement. If not, I am ready to wait for next week.

Sorry, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I was consulting. Perhaps, I could find out what it was. I am not aware. We could move on to the next one. I will come back after consulting.

Vice chairperson of Standing Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am ready to give the statement. However, the Senator for Nandi who sought the Statement is not in.

Let us dispose it off at the end of the Statement Time.

Chairperson, Vice Chairperson or any member of Finance, Commerce and Budget? Yes, Sen. Mositet?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have the response and we have also given the Senator a copy. However, I shall read. The question was to explain why the country still imports over 90 per cent of its footwear requirement at a great cost in terms of foreign exchange and employment creation.

The response is: Kenya’s leather production and exports consist mainly 90 per cent of the semi-processed tan that is wet blue with some finished leather, some leather footwear, handbags, travel wear and other leather products.

The sector has, in the past five years, moved away from export of raw hides and skins to processing and exporting of wet-blue. Despite this development, the sector is still a net foreign exchange consumer with footwear being the major import and wet-blue being the major export. Currently, Kenyan leather is produced and sold as a commodity primarily as semi-processed wet-blue leather with little quality or designed differentiation.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Mr. Vice Chairman, please, summarize.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I thank the Vice Chairperson for the response. There are key issues that I wish to raise. First of all, when the Ministry tells us that the whole sector has been liberalised, which we agree, is the situation such that the Government or the Ministry cannot manage this sector which involves quite a large

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, there are more questions coming up from Members. Maybe you should allow them three minutes.

It was an oversight on my part. I see there are many Members who are interested.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a very sad story. In the 1970s, Kenya used to produce 90 per cent of its shoes and only import 10 per cent. In 2015, Kenya is importing 90 per cent of its shoes and only producing 10 per cent. This is one sector which is terribly underdeveloped and growing backwards. We should be ashamed as a Government to talk of a leather policy which does not move the industry forward.

I had an occasion where I met both the Cabinet Secretary (CS) for the Ministry of Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries and members of the Kenya Leather Development Council (KLDC) in our Committee of Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries. What shocked us was that during this financial year, the Council has been allocated only Kshs3 million in the national Budget. We are talking about creating a leather city. How can we create a leather city with only Kshs3 million? We would like the Vice Chairperson to tell us whether that allocation to the KLDC has been reviewed and increased or whether we are still talking of Kshs3 million.

Order, Members! If you are interested in the intervention, please, press the “intervention” button and not the “requests”.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise to seek certain clarifications. Switzerland is a country of six million people and yet it exports shoes across the world. The market for shoes in Switzerland is not just the Swiss but also worldwide. Therefore, the Chinese people are exporting their shoes here. That is why our industry is dying.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Members, let us be brief.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the type of answer that the Vice Chairperson brought is a very sorry state of affairs for our nation. This country is supposed to have moved from where it was as stated by Sen. Murungi. Today, we are 40 million Kenyans wearing 40 million pairs of shoes every day. Is that not enough market to guarantee us to continue building what we had before? I am saying this because Ethiopia came and photocopied our documents on how a leather industry can be done, today, we import shoes from Ethiopia and Italy.

You need to ask the Ministry through the Committee, to bring here a very serious paper because Kenyans are now being sacked from the industries that were built those days ---

Order, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo! It is Statement time.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, mine is very brief. We know that we have people with vested interests who import shoes from Italy and target the Kenyan market. My understanding is that the population that purchases shoes---

Order, Senator! I thought you said it was brief. Please, interrogate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, yes. I now wanted to throw the bombshell.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, am I in order, if I feel as a pastoralist, that anything that benefits a pastoralist is never given consideration? This is because when it comes to

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Proceed, Vice Chairperson. Order, Proceed, Sen. Leshore.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker---

Order! I have given the opportunity to Sen. Leshore.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me this chance. Sen. Haji has just spoken. The industries which are supposed to alleviate poverty levels among the pastoralists are leather industries, the Kenya Meat Commission (KMC) and mining. All these industries are underfunded and ignored by this Government. I would like to know from the National Treasury and the Ministry of Industrialization and Enterprise Development how much they will give to support the county governments, so that they take up the issue of Small and Medium Enterprises (SMEs) and train the pastoralists in the leather industry.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish to seek clarification with respect to the tanneries that have closed. What will the Government do to ensure that they are reopened in the same manner that other industries have been saved, for instance, the sugar industry? This is an industry which supports very many people, particularly, those in the Arid and Semi-arid Lands (ASALs) .

Mr. Speaker, Sir, Senators have raised very weighty issues. I cannot offer the answers directly here. Through your office, I request that we have a Committee of the Whole meeting with the Cabinet Secretary in charge of this department so that all those issues which have been raised can be answered directly by him and the departments which are fully involved in this.

What is it, Sen. Khaniri?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I beg to vehemently object to what the Vice Chairperson is saying. We are setting a very bad trend. When you get a statement from the relevant Ministry or the Cabinet Secretary, they give you what is called supplementary information. You and I were Ministers in the previous Government and you know how it happens. If Chairpersons will come here and refuse to answer all supplementary questions and say that they want us to go to the Committee of the Whole, then we will not complete business in this House. When Chairpersons come, they must be ready to tackle supplementary questions. We are setting a bad trend.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Is the hon. Senator in order to say, “When we were Ministers?” These days, we do not have Ministers. We have clerks who are called civil secretaries.

Order, Sen. Haji! Neither do we have the gatekeepers for them in the House. So, you are completely out of order.

Vice Chairperson, respond to Sen. Khaniri’s point of order.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, with due respect, we had also subjected the same questions which the Senators have raised to the same request. Up to now, we have not received the response. For example, what Sen. Murungi said; that the Leather Council is

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of information, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Machage! Who do you want to inform?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish to inform Sen. Mositet.

Sen. Mositet, do you wish to be informed?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not wish to be informed.

Order, Members! Sen. Khaniri has made a very valid point to all chairpersons. You must always anticipate supplementary questions and, therefore, you must have supplementary information with you. However, I also appreciate that Members have raised issues affecting the industry. So, maybe the Committee did not anticipate that kind of extent.

Vice Chairperson, you can deal with it in two ways; first, table the issues put to the Cabinet Secretary, if you can get the response within a week, the better. Secondly, if you do not, then get the Committee of the Whole House.

Next statement! Order, Members! We are back to Statement (a) ; the last round.

Sen. Ndiema, we are on Statement (a) .

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am very sorry that I do not have the Statement. We were supposed to have the Cabinet Secretary this morning but the meeting aborted because he was once again at State House. I will pursue him until I get the Statement.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am disappointed because this matter was postponed last week. It was an urgent matter. It is very unfortunate that this Senate has no procedure of even making statements by private notice, the way we used to do in the National Assembly so that matters which are very urgent can be responded to within 48 hours or so.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, 30 people have died in recent clashes on the border of Meru and Isiolo. Out of the clashes, 15 people from Meru County have been arrested. Some are still in custody. We are blaming the security chiefs in the area for discriminating against the Meru Community. That is what the Chairperson; Sen. Haji, was supposed to check; to ask why it is only Merus who being arrested and not Boranas. I still need that answer. If it is possible for him to give the answer tomorrow, I will appreciate. He can camp at the Cabinet Secretary’s office this evening until he gets this answer.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am equally disappointed because I promised the House that I will issue the Statement. Unfortunately, I have not been able to do so. As I said, I will pursue the Cabinet Secretary until I get my brother rested on the issue of Isiolo and Meru.

So, when will you get the answer to the House?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I find it difficult to say tomorrow or the day after. I will try next week.

Can you try to issue it on Thursday?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I will try.

What is it, Sen. Kagwe?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir, allow me to just tell the House that, if I heard Sen. Murungi correctly, did he not say that he wanted to understand why the people in Meru have been arrested or did he say he wanted to know why the Boranas have not been arrested? He should make it clear. I am not sure if I got it correctly.

Order, Members! Sen. Kagwe, after the answer is brought, you can ask that question, if it is not clear yet.

Let us proceed with Statement (b) . Where is Sen. Sijeny, for the Committee on Roads and Transport?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, we communicated to the relevant Cabinet Secretary about Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale’s request on the road to Kakamega, of allocating at least Kshs5 million to repair the road---

Order! Just tell us.

We have written but not received the answer. We have sought a meeting on Thursday. With your permission, we could report to this House on Tuesday next week.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am saddened by the fact that at the moment, there are billions of shillings “flying” around in the name of El Nino intervention funds. The section of this road between Stand Mboga in Kakamega, at Shimala Vandu, all the way to Lubao up to Matsakha is short of probably two-and-a-half kilometres. All we are asking is a quick intervention, so that the road is motorable. Why are they not using the El Nino funds, because this is obviously an area where those funds would apply?

Order, Sen. Khalwale! You know that you need to communicate through the Chair. Why are you looking at that Member? That Statement will be brought next Tuesday.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I want to thank the Chairperson for the Statement which I have just received. It has a number of details in terms of figures and statistics. I request that this Statement be placed, possibly, on the Order Paper tomorrow.

It is so ordered! We try to discourage ambushes from here.

That should be the end of Statements Time.

Hon. Senators, before I proceed to the next Order, I wish to recognize the presence, in the Speaker’s Gallery this afternoon of visiting County Assembly Members and staff from various counties, namely, Vihiga County Assembly, Nyamira County Assembly, Nyandarua County Assembly and Makueni County Assembly.

Hon. Senators, the county assemblies are here on benchmarking visits and attachment to the Senate under the capacity building programme. I request to recognize each member of the delegation and ask them to stand when called out, so that they may be acknowledged in the normal Senate tradition.

From Vihiga County Assembly Public Accounts Committee, we have the following:-

Hon. Tom Atingo - Chairperson Hon. Vincent Atsiaya - Vice Chairperson Hon. Jackson Musunga Hon. Richard Mwihiga Hon Pamela Amunga Hon. Joshua Olao Hon. Wycliffe Masini Hon. Andrew Ahuga Hon. Gladys Analo Hon. Clyde Kweya Hon. Maureen Ambetsa

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Mr. Speaker, Sir, before I join you in welcoming the distinguished delegations, I notice that you skipped the name of one of my Members of the County Assembly, the member for Gisambai, hon. James Shairo Shimanyano. These proceedings are being covered live on television, and I am sure he wants his people in Gisambai to know that he is also here.

The Public Accounts Committee from Vihiga---

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The issue that Sen. Khaniri has raised is very important. When visitors sit in the Speaker’s Gallery, are they seen by the Speaker or by Members in the Chamber? How did Sen. Khaniri know the member for Gisambai is in the Speaker’s Gallery? It is only the Speaker who knows who is in the Speaker’s Gallery.

Order, Sen. Khalwale! It is so obvious. It is also very responsible of the Senator for Vihiga to know when his Members visit this House. From where he is seated, he has the full view of the Speaker’s Gallery. He is right that, that name is not on my list, except just to confirm if that Member is there.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, allow me to hail them for embracing the programme that you introduced of capacity building for our county assemblies. I think this is the fourth and last delegation that is coming from Vihiga. At the end of this attachment I think all the MCAs will have gone through the process.

I want to tell them that the Public Accounts Committee is one of the most important committees in our oversight role as Parliament. I want to encourage them to ensure that the funds that we send to Vihiga County benefit the people of that county. It is up to them to ensure that devolution actually works. We welcome and wish them a fruitful stay in the Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

I wanted to restrict it to the Heads of the county delegation, but I will allow Sen. Obure.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me this opportunity. I want to thank you for welcoming members of the various delegations, including staff from the counties, who have made a visit to the Senate. I am particularly delighted that Members and staff of Nyamira County Assembly are here.

The Members of County Assemblies play a very important role in the success and actualization of devolution. In fact, they are our partners in protecting the interests of the counties and we share the same legislative and oversight roles. I wish each of them a fruitful visit to the Senate and hope that they will acquire new knowledge and learn new techniques, which will help them in the performance of their duties.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. An.

There is only one person from Makueni.

Order! Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. Deserves a chance to speak on this. The quantum is not an issue.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, he was querying why we have only invited one member of staff from Makueni.

First, I want to thank the Office of the Clerk for informing me that a member from the County Assembly of Makueni would be visiting. I would like to encourage that tradition; where the Office of the Clerk notifies the respective Senators. I join you in welcoming them and hope that you are going to extent that invitation and hospitality to all the counties, so that we just do not hear about Vihiga County.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me this opportunity. First of all, I would like to thank your office and the Office of the Clerk for setting up this elaborate programme of training members and staff of the county assemblies. Just like our leader of Delegation, Sen. Obure, said, I am also very delighted to see Members of the County Assembly of Nyamira, which is the sister county to Kisii County. I am happier to see that they are led by the hon. Speaker of Nyamira County, hon. Joash Nyamongo. I ask the Members to learn diligently from what the Senate offers, because it has set up elaborate programmes, which will offer solutions to issues in devolution, particularly their oversight role.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Mr. Speaker, Sir, allow me also to congratulate and welcome the delegations from Nyandarua, Makueni, Nyamira and Vihiga; more particularly, Nyamira County which is led by my very good friend, Hon. Nyamongo and Vihiga County by my very good friend, Tom.

As they come here to learn, I want to encourage them that this “Upper House” is a House of example and very mature and balanced people, representing their counties. I want to encourage them that yesterday, we launched the Okoa Kenya Constitution (Amendment) Bill that will have a major bearing on them. It proposes the setting up of ward funds that will help them run their wards. I want to take the earliest available opportunity to implore them that when the Bill finds its way to their assemblies, they should vote “Yes,” to ensure the progress of the country.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Order, Senators! We should be progressing to Order Nos.8 and 9, but before we do so, there was a request for a Communication from the Chair, which is under preparation. I promise to issue the Communication tomorrow.

I, therefore, defer Order Nos.8 and 9 until that Communication is made.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE CONSIDERATION OF THE PRESIDENTIAL MEMORANDUM ON THE PUBLIC PROCUREMENT AND ASSET DISPOSAL BILL (NATIONAL ASSEMBLY BILL NO.40 OF 2014)

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE CONSIDERATION OF THE PRESIDENTIAL MEMORANDUM ON THE PUBLIC PROCUREMENT AND ASSET DISPOSAL BILL (NATIONAL ASSEMBLY BILL NO.40 OF 2014)

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

What of the clerk who switched off the red light without warning?

We will punish those ones. Who is interested in contributing to this Bill? Given that there is no much interest, I will allow Sen. Wetangula to make use of the balance of his time. That way, we will redeem the clerks from being punished. The Senate Minority Leader (

What did you mean by voting machines?

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, distinguished colleagues who, when the time for voting comes, forget to think and vote. That is what I mean, and you have seen it happen.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

You know our Standing Orders also allow you to move the amendment and not only

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Did you hear Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale say “my party leader,” when I know him as a United Democratic Forum (UDF) Senator?

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Did I hear correctly Sen. Wetangula say that people on this side of the House are voting machines? Could he point or name a voting machine on this side and continue to describe that voting machine? Some people may mistake me for a voting machine.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. With all due respect to my leader, he mentioned voting machines across the Floor. Given that Sen. Boy Juma Boy is seated there, is he part of the voting machines?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, distinguished colleagues who, when the time for voting comes, forget to think and vote. That is what I mean, and you have seen it happen.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. While I entirely agree with my party leader, I would like to remind him that a Senator speaking on the Floor must substantiate his allegations. Could he substantiate who amongst us constitute these “voting machines” because Kenyans are watching? They might think that I am part of the “voting machines.” Could he substantiate who these people are?

Sen. Wetangula, you have been challenged. The Senate Minority Leader (

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Whereas I appreciate the exemption from being a “voting machine,” since I am looking at one as I stand here - and Sen. Wetangula has one that is even more crucial than mine - is he in order to imply that this side of the House has any voting machines except for the instruments that we use to vote?

I refer Sen. Wetangula to Standing Order No. 90 (6) . I will read for him because he seems to have forgotten.

It states:- “A Senator shall refer to another Senator by the title

” You cannot refer to them as voting machines or any other name. Therefore, you are out of order. Can you withdraw and apologize?

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, before I do that---

Order! The order of the Chair was very explicit. Could you withdraw and apologize? Even though you are my party leader, I am now the boss.

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : The boss is driving me to behave like a machine. The instrument that the distinguished Senator for Nyeri is looking at is a machine used for voting and not a voting machine. That is the difference. A voting machine is an animate object and the machine is an inanimate object.

Thank you for the order you have given me. But if anybody cared to read widely, like yours truly has done---

Order, Sen. Wetangula. We

I will invoke the relevant Standing Order. Decide which way you want to go. I will invoke the Standing Order despite you being my party Leader.

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I can assure you that they are enjoying immensely, but I will obey you. I reluctantly withdraw and apologize. I can see some of my colleagues nodding in approval. I can never call Sen. Haji a voting machine, but he knows that there are some voting machines in this House.

Order! The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, this Bill is a liberator. I urge Sen. Musila that this Bill should be expanded. Although each university has an Act covering it, this is a generic law that covers education. It should be expanded also to cover that universities cannot hold on to students’ degree certificates, but they can hold on to the debts owed by the students as civil debts to be

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I have a lot of respect for the Senator for Bungoma, having been my classmate and rika mate. But he is literally exhibiting certain characteristics that I did not know of him; for example, the address of people from certain communities that have got certain characteristics. He is a national leader who should be looking at the whole country holistically. Which are those communities that he is talking about that get jobs straight from universities?

Continue,

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, to begin with, in response to Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale’s point of order, the maxim in law is that ‘to specify one is to exclude others.’ Therefore, when I said ‘in front of me,’ I excluded

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Whereas I appreciate the exemption from being a “voting machine,” since I am looking at one as I stand here - and Sen. Wetangula has one that is even more crucial than mine - is he in order to imply that this side of the House has any voting machines except for the instruments that we use to vote?

I refer Sen. Wetangula to Standing Order No. 90 (6) . I will read for him because he seems to have forgotten. It states:- “A Senator shall refer to another Senator by the title (Senator…(name of the Senator.) ” You cannot refer to them as voting machines or any other name. Therefore, you are out of order. Can you withdraw and apologize? The Senate Minority Leader (

Order, Senator! What is not in order?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, he cannot say that the Jubilee Government is creating corruption while we know that it was created a long time ago by some people who are now in CORD.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Is the hon. Senator in order to mislead this House and the nation and to interrupt presentation of facts by an hon. Senator who has gone to the extent of presenting facts? Is he in order not to counter those facts by another set of facts when we have the real facts before us?

The boss is driving me to behave like a machine. The instrument that the distinguished Senator for Nyeri is looking at is a machine used for voting and not a voting machine. That is the difference. A voting machine is an animate object and the machine is an inanimate object. Thank you for the order you have given me. But if anybody cared to read widely, like yours truly has done---

Order, Sen. Wetangula. We

I will invoke the relevant Standing Order. Decide which way you want to go. I will invoke the Standing Order despite you being my party Leader. The Senate Minority Leader (

Order, Sen. Muthama! Everybody is entitled to his opinion. I do not remember hearing Sen. Kagwe deny that there is any corruption.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you are correct and I am passionate about that. I was the first person to admit that there is corruption in this country. However, what I refuse to accept is that it has been started by the Jubilee Government. I know that corruption has been practiced by persons serving in both Jubilee and CORD.

Your point has been heard. Please, proceed, Sen. Haji

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, this Bill is a liberator. I urge Sen. Musila that this Bill should be expanded. Although each university has an Act covering it, this is a generic law that covers education. It should be expanded also to cover that universities cannot hold on to students’ degree certificates, but they can hold on to the debts owed by the students as civil debts to be

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I have a lot of respect for the Senator for Bungoma, having been my classmate and rika mate. But he is literally exhibiting certain characteristics that I did not know of him; for example, the address of people from certain communities that have got certain characteristics. He is a national leader who should be looking at the whole country holistically. Which are those communities that he is talking about that get jobs straight from universities?

Continue,

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Senator for Nyeri County is my great friend and we share many things, including what we see going on in this country. He is one of the Senators who would never condone what Ms. Waiguru is doing, but he cannot say it.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, with all due respect to my colleague, to say that the Jubilee Government is the one that has created corruption, is pushing it too

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Order, Senator! What is not in order?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, he cannot say that the Jubilee Government is creating corruption while we know that it was created a long time ago by some people who are now in CORD.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Is the hon. Senator in order to mislead this House and the nation and to interrupt presentation of facts by an hon. Senator who has gone to the extent of presenting facts? Is he in order not to counter those facts by another set of facts when we have the real facts before us?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it causes me great pain to see that when the country is bleeding, and foreigners like the Americans are here---

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I meant in this country not the House.

Foreigners are telling us that corruption has gone out of control. Instead of Sen. Kagwe – whom I respect very much together with his late father-in-law, whom I know he got some teaching from because he could not be corrupted – standing before us to deny that there is corruption in this country? He goes ahead to say that there is corruption in CORD---

Order, Sen. Muthama! Everybody is entitled to his opinion. I do not remember hearing Sen. Kagwe deny that there is any corruption.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you are correct and I am passionate about that. I was the first person to admit that there is corruption in this country. However, what I refuse to accept is that it has been started by the Jubilee Government. I know that corruption has been practiced by persons serving in both Jubilee and CORD.

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Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I have a lot of respect for the Senate Minority Leader, especially his level of education. We may not agree on ideals and ideas. However, there are two simple English words that he ought to have learned the meaning of, better. The words “blessed” and “favoured”.

He should substitute the word “favoured” with “blessed”. Blessings come from the good Lord and you cannot stop them.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

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Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, if you noticed, Sen. Wamatangi was purporting to protest. He was actually smiling broadly in appreciation of what I said.

Order, Sen. Muthama! Do you want to exchange with the Chair? Please resume your seat.

Please, proceed, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it is important for the record of this House and for posterity. The Senator for Nyeri County has alleged that on the side of CORD, we have people who are also corrupt. He is entitled to that. However, because many of us on this side have spent our entire life in politics fighting corruption, could he substantiate so that the record remains clear who it is on the CORD side that is corrupt?

Sen. Kagwe, you have been challenged.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for purposes of clarity, let me repeat what I said. I said that in response to the accusation that the Jubilee Government is the one that is creating corruption, it is not true. I admitted that there is corruption in this country, but it is not confined to Jubilee alone. It is in both Jubilee and CORD. Let nobody say that there is a side in this House that can throw a stone.

Order, Sen. Kagwe! This is a House of records. You have been challenged to substantiate and name the corrupt individuals in CORD. You are supposed to either reply or withdraw.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it would be the height of hypocrisy if we were to say as the Hon. Senator from Bungoma has said, that there is corruption in Jubilee that has started with us without naming anybody because a party itself cannot be corrupt. It would be wrong for me to mention names and I know some Members will agree with me. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, that would be the height of hypocrisy if anybody were to stand up to say that the members in CORD are as clean as Caesar’s wife. That would be absolute hypocrisy. It is known that this country suffers from corrupt individuals who sit on both sides of this House. Temporary Speaker (

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Sen. Kagwe, I have not given you time to debate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a legislative Chamber. What the Senate Minority Leader was presenting here were facts. We are aware that we are under the Jubilee Administration. I thank Sen. Kagwe for admitting that there is corruption. That is very good. What Sen. Wetangula presented here was a list of 350 appointments. He stated that 97 of them were from one community and another 67 were from another community yet we are 42 communities.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I am trying to make sure that the records of this House remain intact, because it is a House of records. In your ruling you asked

An

Say that again.

That is a matter of another debate between me and the honourable Senator.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. This Bill has generated a lot of interest. It is obvious that in the Rules and Business Committee (RBC) , we have been trying to see how we can deal with business of this House as quickly as possible. Would I be in order to request the Chair to reduce the time from 20 to 10 minutes? Let Sen. Kagwe be given his 20 minutes but from there on, at least let us spend 10 minutes per speaker so that we conclude this business today and have some time for the Mover to respond and then deal with another business tomorrow.

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Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I have a lot of respect for the Senate Minority Leader, especially his level of education. We may not agree on ideals and ideas. However, there are two simple English words that he ought to have learned the meaning of, better. The words “blessed” and “favoured”.

He should substitute the word “favoured” with “blessed”. Blessings come from the good Lord and you cannot stop them.

Madam Temporary Speaker, in support of Sen. Muthama’s proposal, I rest my case.

I support.

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Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, if you noticed, Sen. Wamatangi was purporting to protest. He was actually smiling broadly in appreciation of what I said.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Very well. I wonder who the weak man in that context is but all the same, you can keep to your thinking.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker Sir. I also rise to support this Bill bringing into perspective what happened a few weeks ago when our children started examinations. When we look at the situation now, we ask ourselves as a House of Senate, if indeed, the children who a have just finished their Kenya Certificate of Secondary Education (KCSE) exams will really one day not be affected by what we saw of the examination management and procedure; on how the examination was handled and the cheating that took place.

I want to thank Sen. Musila that we are now coming to the core of the challenges which parents have faced for many years in terms of paying school fees for their children. They end up finding themselves going to school, sometimes the gates are closed, you cannot access the school to go and plead that your child has been given a position to join university but does not have his or her certificate and the documents required. Many parents have suffered in this country because of that.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it is time we overhauled the whole system of the Kenya National Examinations Council starting from the clerks. You find that while you are a parent labouring for more than 12 to 14 years to see your child at another level of education---. I remember the children of Maranda National School. I will never forget what those parents went through. Their children had passed, but because of a computer error, of which even when you ask the Kenya National Examination Council, that if you can disqualify children because of a computer error, then it means the manual one is more terrible. Those children had a rough time because they repeated a whole year to sit for exams and get their certificates.

As we move on, we need to amend the Bill and ensure that we have penalties for both sides. We cannot have a situation where one party dictates to the other without arbitration. Both parties must take responsibilities and be fair to each other. If we do that, the children cannot go through this suffering.

This has made the children change their values. That is the reason why we have got more cases of exam cheating or leakages because they want to pass their exams. This notion that we must have certificates in this country has also killed our education system.

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November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I support this Bill and I thank Sen. Musila. In the Tenth Parliament, he tirelessly promoted this and he talked about it so much. It is very sad that even after we passed it in the Tenth Parliament, this has not been implemented. This brings us back to the issue that we always talk about in

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Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, from the outset, I rise to support the amendments to the Act and congratulate Sen. Musila. He has been with the Committee on Education, both when I chaired the Committee and now as a Member. I have witnessed his participation when we invited stakeholders, officials from the Ministry and so on. Sen. Musila has never missed a single sitting even though he is not a Member of the Committee because of passion. I also recognise and appreciate that he actually wants to amend an Act that he participated in creating.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Act that he wants amended was passed because of the same problem that he had noticed at that time and which still persists. At some point, former President Kibaki ordered the release of all the certificates that were being withheld. I am aware that Sen. Musila has tried to see whether we can issue the same decree to have all certificates released. However, everything has got good and bad bits. Today, because of the Constitution that we have, if President Uhuru ordered that, he would probably be taken to court by somebody. So, it is only fitting then that we create the institutional framework that is necessary to get the job done. The job that we are trying to get done is to issue certificates to children.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, there is a sense in which this is a sad Bill. It is because it should not be necessary for us to pass a law in Parliament so that children from poor families can be given their certificates to look for jobs. I wish it was not necessary to have this Bill. In a civilized society, it should not be necessary for us to have a Bill like this. It should have been very obvious to everybody that a certificate that is being withheld can only be done so for one reason only and that is, the person cannot afford to pay. If the person could afford to pay, the certificate would not be held in the first place.

I am aware that there could be one or two notorious individuals who may just be refusing to pay. However, the average person would not withhold money from their own children so that their certificates are denied. If, indeed, it is the parents who have not paid, the sins of the father should not be meted on the child. When you think about a child walking to a school to beg for a certificate, explaining that the mother cannot pay and that they want to try their luck to join the police force or military – the only chance that they have to get out of poverty – and the child is denied that certificate, you weep for the nation.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, we have debated the proposed amendments in the Committee. A lot of debate still continues because we have people who object to this amendment. Those who are objecting to these amendments are head teachers because of

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An

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Order! Hon. Senator, I do not know if I heard you well. Did you say that you were going to use me as an example? I do not understand. I kept quiet because I thought you wanted to state my name at birth, and maybe my marital name. If you do not clarify that kind of statement, I might be left in an awkward situation because people might think the name at birth happens not to bear the names on my certificates.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I wanted to use you as an example, but I studied your demeanor, you were serious and stern. Then looking around, I saw Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo who looked more amenable to act as an example.

Thank you for your observation. We are considering it. I will give my ruling.

Proceed, Senator.

Madam Temporary Speaker, in support of Sen. Muthama’s proposal, I rest my case.

I support.

Thank you, Senator. Proceed, Sen. Muthama, Senate Minority Whip.

Bi Spika wa Muda, ninaunga mkono Mswada huu. Mwaka wa 2004, kabla sijaingia Bunge, nakumbuka vizuri nikisoma na kusikiliza vyombo vya habari vikisema kwamba Mswada wa kuwapa watoto wa maskini na hasa wale ambao hawajapata stakabadhi zao nafasi ya kuzipata umepitishwa Bungeni kwa juhudi zake Sen. Musila.

Mwaka wa 2008, niliingia Bungeni na Sen. Musila akiwa Mbunge wa Mwingi alilifufua jambo hili na likazungumziwa mara ya pili. Katika Seneti hii sasa, jambo hili limekuja hapa, limezungumziwa, limepitishwa na leo tunalijadili jambo hilo tu. Swali ni; je, ni nani ambaye hafanyi kazi yake katika taifa letu? Hatufai kuzungumza sana juu ya Mswada huu kwa sababu ni dhahiri kwamba jambo tunalolizungumzia na kulisisitiza linawahusu watoto wa maskini.

Hakuna mtoto wa mtu anayejiweza ambaye hajachukua stakabadhi zake katika shule yoyote ya upili. Lakini wale watoto wa maskini ndio tunaowazungumzia. Leo ninataka kusema kwamba Sen. Musila labda katika mijadala na miswada iliyopita

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November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Madam Temporary Speaker, the KNEC was set up in 1980 to focus on Kenyan examination matters. What existed previously was the East African Examinations Council (EAEC) . At that point, it was about examinations in terms of accuracy of presentation of the results and reliability and validity of those results. That was the key mandate of KNEC. That Act was later replaced by Act No.29 of 2012, repealing the previous Cap.225 Act of 1980 trying to make sure that the KNEC becomes a stronger unit.

It has already been mentioned by other Senators that the idea was to make sure, for example, disseminating results to students is done very effectively. Already, the law allocates that there should not be any withholding of any certificate. Unfortunately in reality, this is what has happened over time. Therefore, many students ended up suffering because they cannot get their certificates. We know that without primary and secondary school level certificates, there are some people who can get jobs, but they do not because they cannot show their results. In Kenya, results are not given orally, but in the form of a certificate. So, the certificate becomes something very powerful that an institution can give.

Madam Temporary Speaker, for many years, it is the schools that have had that power. When we were debating this Bill at the Committee and also the public participation level, what came out very clearly was the balance between the payment of fees and the quagmire of most schools that they decided to withhold the certificates because that way, they felt they could make parents pay. We did not want a situation where people then decide that, why should I pay and at the end of the day, I will still get the certificate?

There are different sets of parents and, at that point, we wanted to believe that there are no parents who just make the decision not to pay just for the sake of it. Therefore, we had to be careful that we have a balance, that, we do not open it up too much to the point that even parents who could pay, decide they will not pay because they can get away with it. If there are certain school fees or provisions by the secondary schools that are expected to be paid; it is expected that the parent will pay. Therefore, getting that balance was critical for us. That balance and ensuring that, that child gets the certificate, at the end of the day, will be balanced by removing the responsibility from the school. Initially, it is not even the child who should be punished. In the first place, it is the parent’s responsibility to ensure that, that fee has been paid.

If we punish the child by withholding that certificate, we are actually punishing the wrong person. The idea also was to ensure that one way or another, that balance is created very well. Various ideas were given, one of which Sen. Kisasa has just mentioned. If there could be a way of balancing out so that you hold this student accountable in one way or another, in some kind of loan or fees so that, that certificate is

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Madam Temporary Speaker, I rise to support this Bill and commend my brother, Sen. Musila, for this good Bill, but we can make it better. The New Clause Three: 45 (a) (i) can be considered in the Committee of the Whole; it should be changed so as to include primary, secondary and college level. There are students in polytechnics, teachers training colleges and medical training colleges who also suffer the same fate from the leadership of those institutions.

Secondly, Clause Three: 45 (a) can further be made better by saying that “the district officer shall not withhold a certificate.” We can go ahead and say that “the district

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Thank you, Madam Temporary, Speaker. I join my colleagues in thanking and congratulating Sen. Musila, who is almost synonymous with the demand for the release of certificates to our children. I am surprised that nobody has heard him speak. We are very interesting people where even the parents whose children have their certificates detained, we do not want to listen. This is not the first time and not even in the Jubilee Government that this story of certificates has been brought up. I am told, Sen. Musila, when you were in the previous Parliament, this was your song. Why did anybody not listen to you until now that we are moving to pass this Bill?

Today, I do not know whether you are aware we have about 18 Bills which have been generated by the Senate that are supposed to have been cleared by the Senate and then sent to the “Lower” House and nobody has put them on the Order Paper. I am praying very hard like yourself that as soon as this Bill is passed by the Senate, somebody whose children’s certificates are detained by the headteachers is in the “Lower” House. Most of us are voted by Kenyans whose children’s certificates have been detained. When it comes to voting time, they are so faithful to vote for us, but we do not bother when it comes to defending the right of their children to get their certificates.

Madam Temporary Speaker, if there is something that is at the heart of every Kenyan today, it is education as a whole ranging from nursery school to university. It is the only thing that everybody knows about Kenya, unfortunately, it is the only Ministry and the only agenda that has been messed up more than ever before. It is so shameful, indeed, that the trend which has been generated for the last four to five years is that there is exam leakage. With the current social media and everybody in the whole world knows that there is exam leakage and yet the best brains in Kenya go to top universities in the whole world with a rider that during that time when they sat for their exam, there was exam leakage.

Recently, we saw that even this year’s KCSE exams, there was leakage. We, probably, saw it in the newspapers. I am worried about the schools that normally do very well when marking time comes, those are the schools that will feel the pinch and will suffer most because of the inefficiency of the KNEC. They normally like wiping their tears on such innocent schools. They do not touch national schools. Three years ago, a school that I support did very well in the exams. They were No.2 in the whole Republic under category of district schools, Karenger Boys.

The following year someone wondered how giants like Moi Girls, Eldoret were beaten by these small schools. Somehow, they came up with something called collusion. When you asked what it is, they did not open it up. That is where the KNEC hides their mess. They say collusion is not investigated. During collusion, there was a policeman in

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Order! Hon. Senator, I do not know if I heard you well. Did you say that you were going to use me as an example? I do not understand. I kept quiet because I thought you wanted to state my name at birth, and maybe my marital name. If you do not clarify that kind of statement, I might be left in an awkward situation because people might think the name at birth happens not to bear the names on my certificates.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I wanted to use you as an example, but I studied your demeanor, you were serious and stern. Then looking around, I saw Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo who looked more amenable to act as an example.

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November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

In the spirit of balancing debate, from both sides of the House, I will allow Sen. Kisasa a chance to speak even though you were still far below in the list. There are four Senators before you, but I have allowed you, using my discretion.

Asante Bi. Spika wa Muda kwa kunipa fursa hii. Kama vile umesema, umenipendelea, nashukuru sana. Nampa pongezi Sen. Musila kwa sababu Mswada huu umebobea kama yeye. Kuna sababu ambazo zinafanya stakabadhi hizi zizuiliwe shuleni. Kuna sababu mpya ambayo imejitokeza. Kuna haya masomo ya ziada ambayo ukienda shuleni kuchukua stakabadhi, utaambiwa hakulipa pesa za remedial. Pia, kuna stakabadhi zingine ambazo zinazuiliwa kwa sababu ya ukosefu wa nidhamu kwa mtoto.

Kama mtoto hana nidhamu, na hata kama umelipa karo, utaambiwa zimezuiliwa kwa sababu ya nidhamu. Lazima tuangalie vile tutafanya ama tutawajibika vipi ile watoto wawe na nidhamu. Mwanafunzi ataogopa kwamba stakabadhi yake itazuiliwa kama atakuwa na ukosefu wa nidhamu. Hizi stakabadhi zimetumika hususan wanafunzi wawe na nidhamu kwa kuhofia kuwa hatazipata kama atakosa nidhamu.

Sheria hii inafundisha watoto wawe na nidhamu. Inabidi tutafute njia mbadala ya kuwafanya watoto wetu wawe na nidhamu. Ukubwa wa pua sio wingi wa kamasi. Hizi stakabadhi zimejaa ofisini lakini zinamsaidia nani? Kuna ofisi ambayo inavuja na hizi ni stakabadhi muhimu.

Nimefurahi kutokana na Mswada huu kwa sababu Sen. Musila ameeleza kuwa watu wanafaa kupewa stakabadhi na nampa hongera kwa hilo. Hii inamanisha kuwa mkuu wa taarafa ataweza kuamrisha stakabadhi zipewe wenyewe. Sijui hilo litakuwa vipi kwa sababu kuna stakabadhi ambazo zimekaa kwa muda mrefu bila kuchukuliwa na wenyewe. Hii ndio maana hapo awali nilisema kuwa Mswada huu umebobea kama yeye mwenyewe kwa sababu hayo ndio matamanio ya kila mzazi. Hakuna masika yasiyokuwa na mbu.

Bi. Spika wa Muda, ukizingatia pilkapilka za watoto wanapofanya mtihani, huenda ukajiuliza jinsi jasho lao litafutwa endapo mtu hatapewa stakabadhi yake. Huenda pia mashirika mbalimbali yakalala kwa sababu watoto wetu wengi hawana stakabadhi. Mtu akitafuta kazi, atapatikana hana stakabadhi. Kwa hivyo, kama Serikali ama nchi, hatutajumuika kuangalia jinsi vijana wetu wataishi ama kazi watakazopewa kwa sababu hakuna marefu yasiokuwa na ncha. Wazazi wengi wamekuwa wakilia kuhusiana na swala la karo. Tunataka stakabadhi zitolewe. Mwanafunzi akiingia shuleni muhula wa kwanza ama kidato cha kwanza, inabidi alipiwe karo. Ni bora watoto wetu katika shule

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November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Madam Temporary Speaker, the KNEC was set up in 1980 to focus on Kenyan examination matters. What existed previously was the East African Examinations Council (EAEC) . At that point, it was about examinations in terms of accuracy of presentation of the results and reliability and validity of those results. That was the key mandate of KNEC. That Act was later replaced by Act No.29 of 2012, repealing the previous Cap.225 Act of 1980 trying to make sure that the KNEC becomes a stronger unit.

It has already been mentioned by other Senators that the idea was to make sure, for example, disseminating results to students is done very effectively. Already, the law allocates that there should not be any withholding of any certificate. Unfortunately in reality, this is what has happened over time. Therefore, many students ended up suffering because they cannot get their certificates. We know that without primary and secondary school level certificates, there are some people who can get jobs, but they do not because they cannot show their results. In Kenya, results are not given orally, but in the form of a certificate. So, the certificate becomes something very powerful that an institution can give.

Madam Temporary Speaker, for many years, it is the schools that have had that power. When we were debating this Bill at the Committee and also the public participation level, what came out very clearly was the balance between the payment of fees and the quagmire of most schools that they decided to withhold the certificates because that way, they felt they could make parents pay. We did not want a situation where people then decide that, why should I pay and at the end of the day, I will still get the certificate?

There are different sets of parents and, at that point, we wanted to believe that there are no parents who just make the decision not to pay just for the sake of it. Therefore, we had to be careful that we have a balance, that, we do not open it up too much to the point that even parents who could pay, decide they will not pay because they can get away with it. If there are certain school fees or provisions by the secondary schools that are expected to be paid; it is expected that the parent will pay. Therefore, getting that balance was critical for us. That balance and ensuring that, that child gets the certificate, at the end of the day, will be balanced by removing the responsibility from the school. Initially, it is not even the child who should be punished. In the first place, it is the parent’s responsibility to ensure that, that fee has been paid.

If we punish the child by withholding that certificate, we are actually punishing the wrong person. The idea also was to ensure that one way or another, that balance is created very well. Various ideas were given, one of which Sen. Kisasa has just mentioned. If there could be a way of balancing out so that you hold this student accountable in one way or another, in some kind of loan or fees so that, that certificate is

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We want to bring this Motion to a close today. The next speaker is Sen. (Prof.) Lesan.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, thank you for giving me this opportunity. First, I wish to thank Sen. Musila for bringing this amendment. As a Member of the Committee on Education, I have observed the passion with which he has followed this case. Although he is not a Member of the Committee on Education, he made more appearances than some Members of the Committee. I want to thank him for bringing this important amendment to the education sector, which will help a lot of students. It is important that this Bill has come up today when 900,000 pupils have started their Kenya Certificate of Primary Education (KCPE) examinations in Kenya. It is also important to note that there are close to tens of thousands in South Sudan sitting for the same examination.

Madam Temporary Speaker, many bad things, including exam leakages, were said about the Kenya Certificate of Secondary Education (KCSE) examinations which are coming to a conclusion. It is very unfortunate that if you trace the cause of these leakages, the ball will rest with the officers of the KNEC because they are the ones who set and keep custody of the exams. Before anyone else sees the examination papers, they are in the custody of the KNEC. I know that when the results will be announced, schools and students will be penalised for some of these activities. We would like to see people held responsible for these exam leakages in KCPE or KCSE.

One of the best amendments which are being made is the identification of who will do the exam. Embossing a photograph is one of the things proposed. As suggested by Senators, we can do digital photography. But we can also do a barcode on the students, not only when they are doing their exams, but also as they enter schools. A student could possess a barcode throughout their education and their documents identified through it. I know there is a lot of corruption in this country. Last year, I was in Canada with a

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Madam Temporary Speaker, I rise to support this Bill and commend my brother, Sen. Musila, for this good Bill, but we can make it better. The New Clause Three: 45 (a) (i) can be considered in the Committee of the Whole; it should be changed so as to include primary, secondary and college level. There are students in polytechnics, teachers training colleges and medical training colleges who also suffer the same fate from the leadership of those institutions.

Secondly, Clause Three: 45 (a) can further be made better by saying that “the district officer shall not withhold a certificate.” We can go ahead and say that “the district

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Your time is up, Senator!

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker.

Thank you, Madam Temporary, Speaker. I join my colleagues in thanking and congratulating Sen. Musila, who is almost synonymous with the demand for the release of certificates to our children. I am surprised that nobody has heard him speak. We are very interesting people where even the parents whose children have their certificates detained, we do not want to listen. This is not the first time and not even in the Jubilee Government that this story of certificates has been brought up. I am told, Sen. Musila, when you were in the previous Parliament, this was your song. Why did anybody not listen to you until now that we are moving to pass this Bill?

Today, I do not know whether you are aware we have about 18 Bills which have been generated by the Senate that are supposed to have been cleared by the Senate and then sent to the “Lower” House and nobody has put them on the Order Paper. I am praying very hard like yourself that as soon as this Bill is passed by the Senate, somebody whose children’s certificates are detained by the headteachers is in the “Lower” House. Most of us are voted by Kenyans whose children’s certificates have been detained. When it comes to voting time, they are so faithful to vote for us, but we do not bother when it comes to defending the right of their children to get their certificates.

Madam Temporary Speaker, if there is something that is at the heart of every Kenyan today, it is education as a whole ranging from nursery school to university. It is the only thing that everybody knows about Kenya, unfortunately, it is the only Ministry and the only agenda that has been messed up more than ever before. It is so shameful, indeed, that the trend which has been generated for the last four to five years is that there is exam leakage. With the current social media and everybody in the whole world knows that there is exam leakage and yet the best brains in Kenya go to top universities in the whole world with a rider that during that time when they sat for their exam, there was exam leakage.

Recently, we saw that even this year’s KCSE exams, there was leakage. We, probably, saw it in the newspapers. I am worried about the schools that normally do very well when marking time comes, those are the schools that will feel the pinch and will suffer most because of the inefficiency of the KNEC. They normally like wiping their tears on such innocent schools. They do not touch national schools. Three years ago, a school that I support did very well in the exams. They were No.2 in the whole Republic under category of district schools, Karenger Boys.

The following year someone wondered how giants like Moi Girls, Eldoret were beaten by these small schools. Somehow, they came up with something called collusion. When you asked what it is, they did not open it up. That is where the KNEC hides their mess. They say collusion is not investigated. During collusion, there was a policeman in

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

I call upon the Mover to reply. Unfortunately, you have exactly two minutes. We have to be out of the Chamber at 6.45

Madam Temporary Speaker, with those two minutes, I express my thanks and gratitude to each and every Senator who has contributed. If I had time, I would read their names, but I do not have. They are a total of 18. All of them were very supportive. I know there were many others who would have liked to contribute to this Motion, but because of the time limit, they could not.

I also thank the Senate Committee on Education because they facilitated dialogue with the stakeholders. We had meetings with the parents, TSC, Cabinet Secretary of Education and the KNEC.

Madam Temporary Speaker, 11 years ago, I started this journey. Then, my head was full of hair. Today, when I look at the mirror, I can see I do not have hair. I pray that this is the last action that this Senate is taking to achieve what we failed to achieve in the last 11 years. Therefore, I promise the House that I will follow very keenly all the contributions that have been made. I will ensure that we take on board all suggestions when we come to making the amendments for the Third Reading.

With these remarks, I beg to move.

We all pray that the Bill will be assented to before you lose all your hair.

November 10, 2015 SENATEDEBATES

Madam Temporary Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order No.54 (3) , I beg to move that you put off the Question to tomorrow.

Thank you.

We will take the Question tomorrow, together with the other Bills, at 2.30 p.m.