Thursday, 13th October, 2016

Hon. Senators, I wish to report to the Senate that pursuant to Standing Order No.40 (3) and (4) , I received the following Message from the Speaker of the National Assembly regarding the passage by the Assembly, of the County Assemblies Powers and Privileges Bill (Senate Bill No.14 of 2014) .

“Pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order No.41 (1) of the National Assembly Standing Orders, I hereby convey the following message from the National Assembly:-

WHEREAS The County Assemblies Powers and Privileges Bill (Senate Bill No.14 of 2014) was published vide Kenya Gazette Supplement No.54 of 22nd April, 2014 as a Bill concerning county governments, seeking to give effect to the provisions of Article 196 (3) of the Constitution by providing for the powers, privileges and immunities of county assemblies, their committees and members and to make provisions regulating admittance to and conduct within the precincts of county assemblies;

WHEREAS the said Bill was passed by the Senate on Tuesday, 2nd December, 2014 and referred to the National Assembly for consideration, and whereas the National Assembly passed the said Bill on Wednesday, 5th October, 2016 without amendments and in the form passed by the Senate;

NOW THEREFORE, in accordance with the provisions of Article 110 of the Constitution and Standing Order No.41 (1) of the National Assembly Standing Orders, I hereby convey the decision of the National assembly to the Senate.”

Consequently, pursuant to Article 110 (5) of the Constitution, the Bill will be referred to the President for assent.

I thank you. Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.!

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a Bill from the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights. I am happy that the National Assembly has agreed to our Bill without any amendments. At the risk of sounding mischievous, I would like to suggest that you accompany that Bill to State House and have it signed in your presence, as a sign that the Senate is working. Otherwise, we will lose the opportunity when the Bill is signed in the presence of other people.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I support Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.’s assertions. Three weeks ago I had a meeting with the Members of the National Assembly to partly interrogate the Bill that I had presented before the Senate. They were really amused that we are not working on the basis that, that was the only Bill they had of 2015. Therefore, it would be necessary for you to accompany that Bill, so that people can know that there are also Bills that emanate from the Senate and are assented to by the President upon the completion of the processes internally in Parliament.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, as we celebrate about the happenings in the National Assembly, assent to a Bill does not necessarily mean that it turns into law. We have ‘the Sang Bill’ in limbo because of the court process. This process should be fast-tracked so that we see the light at the end of the tunnel of “the Sang Bill.”

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Machage! Just because different things have different fates does not stop us from working. The House needs to appreciate this kind of collaboration between the two Houses that has resulted into this one. For purposes of Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr., this is our Bill. Therefore, it will only be natural that I be there.

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would, probably, say that it is a little too late, but we appreciate. I laud you in a matter that happened this morning. You made me proud of you as our Speaker for standing your ground and telling your brother in the “lower” House, that Parliament is not just about the National Assembly; that there are two Houses of Parliament enjoying equal authority, privileges and power.

Keep it up. We shall stand with you.

Next Order!

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would, probably, say that it is a little too late, but we appreciate. I laud you in a matter that happened this morning. You made me proud of you as our Speaker for standing your ground and telling your brother in the “lower” House, that Parliament is not just about the National Assembly; that there are two Houses of Parliament enjoying equal authority, privileges and power. Keep it up. We shall stand with you.

Next Order!

concluded during Tuesday’s Sitting and particularly, dispose of Bills awaiting Division either at the Second Reading or the Committee of the Whole. The Senate will consider any other business scheduled by the SBC.

As you may recall, the Senate yesterday amended its calendar to push forward the recess that was scheduled to commence tomorrow, so as to commence next week on Thursday. In regard, I will move a Motion for adjournment on Wednesday, 19th October, 2016 for the Senate to proceed on a short recess from 20th October, 2016 and resume on 1st November, 2016.

In conclusion----

concluded during Tuesday’s Sitting and particularly, dispose of Bills awaiting Division either at the Second Reading or the Committee of the Whole. The Senate will consider any other business scheduled by the SBC.

As you may recall, the Senate yesterday amended its calendar to push forward the recess that was scheduled to commence tomorrow, so as to commence next week on Thursday. In regard, I will move a Motion for adjournment on Wednesday, 19th October, 2016 for the Senate to proceed on a short recess from 20th October, 2016 and resume on 1st November, 2016.

In conclusion----

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I rise under Standing Order No.45 (2) (c) , which provides for issuance of the statement by the Senate Majority Leader. It says:-

“The Senate Majority Leader or, in his or her absence the Senate Minority Leader or, in the absence of both the Senate Majority and the Senate Minority Leader, a member of the Rules and Business Committee designated by the Senate Majority Leader for that purpose shall, every Thursday or on the last sitting day of the week, present and lay on the Table, a statement informing the Senate of the business coming before the Senate in the following week.” It is self-explanatory. Why is Sen. Murkomen flouting Standing Order No.45 (2)

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am very conscious of my role as the Deputy Majority Leader, which Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale should be aware of. The role of the Deputy Majority Leader includes deputizing the Senate Majority Leader for every responsibility. There is a relevant Standing Order which defines the Office of the Senate Majority Leader and in the same way, the Office of the Deputy Majority Leader and how they relate together, just like the President and the Deputy President.

What is it, Sen. Muthama?

or ignore him.

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula): Mr. Speaker, Sir, we are not angling to make statements here, but we urge you to enforce the rules. The Standing Order quoted by the distinguished Senators who have spoken before me is very clear. I know that Sen. Murkomen might run to Standing Order No.45(2)(d), but it does not apply. It only applies where, for example, the Senate Majority Leader was to move a Bill. If he is not in the House, then he can ask his Deputy to move a Bill. Otherwise, Standing Order No.45(2)(c) is explicit in its entirety. It is either the Senate Majority Leader or the Senate Minority Leader and in our absence, any Member of the Senate Business Committee (SBC) which may include Sen. Ong’era, Sen. Orengo, Sen. Murungi, Sen. Mugo, Sen. Muthama and so on. Nowhere is it said that in our absence, our deputies would issue the statement.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, therefore, we urge you to enforce these rules strictly for the future. It reminds me of General Alexander Haig running to a television station and saying he was totally in charge when President Reagan was shot by Hinckley.

or ignore him.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Could you correct the Senator for Elgeyo-Marakwet because my name is not Sen. Wetangula? It is me who stood in this place and raised a point of order. How can he refer to me as Sen. Wetangula?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, yesterday, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale brought the analogy of Luhya dogs. If a dog barks, it does so on behalf of its owner. You could see the truncation and the relationship between the one who was doing and the substantive one who finally came with a lot of passion.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want us to look at Standing Order No.19 which defines the role of the Deputy Senate Majority Leader and Deputy Senate Minority Leader. I know the Senate Minority Leader would like to suffocate his deputy, but the Standing Orders already define that whenever the Senate Majority Leader is absent or unable to perform his or her functions, the Deputy Senate Majority Leader shall perform the functions of the Senate Majority Leader in an acting capacity. This Standing Order does not have an exception. It covers all the deputation of the roles of the Speaker and there is a similar provision regarding the Senate Majority Leader. There is also a similar provision for a whip and his or her deputy. As I said earlier, it is my disclaimer that I am more than happy to hand over the paper to Sen. Wetangula to read it.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this issue seems to be contagious because it had been discussed previously and the ruling was that the Senate Majority Leader and Senate Minority Leader, as referred in this Standing Orders, are offices. I remember we argued much about that, but the ruling was that they are offices and not individuals. So, as you make the ruling, please, make it very clear so that this is resolved henceforth.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have never been and I am not hungry for power. I have never been in the situation of Sen. Wetangula and I do not seek to be as hungry as he is. You can see how passionate he was that he is not issuing the statement. This is a very simple statement and anybody, in my own regard, can issue it. If Sen. Wetangula is really passionate that he should do it, I will gladly surrender to him.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Could you correct the Senator for Elgeyo-Marakwet because my name is not Sen. Wetangula? It is me who stood in this place and raised a point of order. How can he refer to me as Sen. Wetangula?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I have just walked in, but I was following this live debate on radio and I heard clearly Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale ask you to rule in view of Standing Order No.45(2)(b). Sen. Murkomen is now taking advantage of that to impute improper motives on the Senate Minority Leader and we should not let this to continue. Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale was very clear. He wanted to know whether Sen. Murkomen was in order in view of Standing Order No.45(2)(b). We do not want to listen to Sen. Murkomen’s opinion or views, but we would like to get the ruling of the Speaker on this particular matter.

that comes after the absence of both the Senate Majority Leader and the Senate Minority Leader.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, a man who dies to read a statement and wants to be the President of Kenya--- Your guess is as good as mine. This is just a straightforward statement.

that comes after the absence of both the Senate Majority Leader and the Senate Minority Leader.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I know that in the past you have ruled on this matter, but it is important for us to get the clarity regarding the person who signed the statement. Sen. Murkomen read it and said it was signed by the Senate Majority Leader (Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki) and Sen. Murkomen. It is important for us to know who signed it.

Order! Senators! Sen. Murkomen, relax and take it easy. You can still read the statement like Senator Haig.

But Mr. Speaker, Sir, you have to protect me from Sen. Wetangula and his surrogates. However, I will continue reading the Statement.

As I conclude, allow me to remind you that we have substantial business pending before the Senate, especially Bills as well as other oversight responsibilities that are being spearheaded by committees. As we approach the homestretch of the final lap of our term, I request Senators to put more effort to facilitate the Senate to dispose of the pending business which firmly entrench the legacy that was introduced to the Senate in the annals of our history as a country. I hereby lay the Statement. I thank you.

This Statement was signed by Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki, the Senate Majority Leader and read by Sen. Murkomen on his behalf.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I know that in the past you have ruled on this matter, but it is important for us to get the clarity regarding the person who signed the statement. Sen. Murkomen read it and said it was signed by the Senate Majority Leader (Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki) and Sen. Murkomen. It is important for us to know who signed it.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I was trying to remind---

Order, Sen. Murkomen! You need to abide by our rules. You have to put a request. It was obvious that you were to respond, but you still need permission. You may now proceed.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, Sen. Sang has raised a very important issue which must not be ignored with regard to the direction that you gave. The statement was

Mr. Speaker, Sir, you have introduced an entirely different aspect on our concerns when you said that the statement that has been read by Sen. Murkomen is not signed. That is not admissible under the rules of this House. With your kind permission, since the Senate Minority leader is present, he be allowed to prepare a statement, he signs it and reads it for it to be admissible.

If Sen. Murkomen wants to know which Standing Order I am proceeding under, he is free to visit my office. I will be happy to teach him.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. It is absolutely important that we deal with this matter conclusively so that it does not recur. This is because this is the third or fourth time this matter is coming to the Floor. In view of the revelation that you have just made to the House that the statement is not signed, I request you to make a ruling on whether the statement is valid because the rules of this House are very clear. The rules state that any statement or document laid on the Table must be duly signed.

Secondly, my assumption of the anticipation of Standing Order No.45 (2) (c) was that the Senate Majority Leader or the Senate Minority Leader are laying these statements on behalf of the Senate Rules and Business Committee because they are the leaders of both sides. There is no seniority here. I also want you to make a ruling on what Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale has just raised because I believe that either of the two leaders can sign the statement.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale of the Luhya parables has made a very serious allegation. He has said that anyone who stands on a point of order can just say that they are rising on a point of order and they do not have to say under which point of order are they are rising. If someone challenges him to say under

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

What is it, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale? I hope you do not want to address this matter because we have concluded it.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, you have introduced an entirely different aspect on our concerns when you said that the statement that has been read by Sen. Murkomen is not signed. That is not admissible under the rules of this House. With your kind permission, since the Senate Minority leader is present, he be allowed to prepare a statement, he signs it and reads it for it to be admissible.

If Sen. Murkomen wants to know which Standing Order I am proceeding under, he is free to visit my office. I will be happy to teach him.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. It is absolutely important that we deal with this matter conclusively so that it does not recur. This is because this is the third or fourth time this matter is coming to the Floor. In view of the revelation that you have just made to the House that the statement is not signed, I request you to make a ruling on whether the statement is valid because the rules of this House are very clear. The rules state that any statement or document laid on the Table must be duly signed.

Secondly, my assumption of the anticipation of Standing Order No.45 (2) (c) was that the Senate Majority Leader or the Senate Minority Leader are laying these statements on behalf of the Senate Rules and Business Committee because they are the leaders of both sides. There is no seniority here. I also want you to make a ruling on what Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale has just raised because I believe that either of the two leaders can sign the statement.

what specific Standing Order did he raise that issue?

Order, Members! I will dispose of this one because you decided to go this route. That is the route we shall pursue. Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, it is not your privilege or an opportunity for you to be visited by a Member when you are challenged on the Standing Order you are citing. Unlike other Members, you have always asked of the same. This is your opportunity, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, now to state the Standing Order under which you raised the matter.

this matter, this statement is not admissible.

I have a copy of it and other statements. They are all signed by a Member requesting or a Chairperson. Every time documents are presented, we are challenged. We must confirm that they have been signed.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I thank you for giving me this chance. It will be very bad if it remains in the records of this House that I deliberately in any way suggested that you are favouring or interfering with Sen. Murkomen. I did not mean that. Allow me to tender my apology to you and withdraw, if those words meant that to you.

Order, hon. Senators! First, I would have allowed this one to die a natural death except that Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale usually insist on matters of points of order. It is only natural.

Secondly, you have taken it completely out of context. I can understand where it originates from and ends. As a doctor, regarding the medium, I do not see any of your professional skills applying. If anything, it belongs to physical scientists like yours truly.

Having said so, Sen. Murkomen took you on specifically on the issue of which Standing Order. He made that request. You only referred to it when you had the Floor, but he said, “Which one? Therefore, your Speaker is not interfering. In fact, I have allowed so much latitude in these discussions which are not completely necessary. For you to impute improper motives that I am protecting a particular Member just because you have been challenged is wrong.

However, I have made an observation. I do not want to do an over kill on a non- issue. I will leave it to your conscience, but in terms of the substantive issue Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale raised in terms of whether this statement to be laid on the Table is admissible

this matter, this statement is not admissible.

I have a copy of it and other statements. They are all signed by a Member requesting or a Chairperson. Every time documents are presented, we are challenged. We must confirm that they have been signed.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I thank you for giving me this chance. It will be very bad if it remains in the records of this House that I deliberately in any way suggested that you are favouring or interfering with Sen. Murkomen. I did not mean that. Allow me to tender my apology to you and withdraw, if those words meant that to you.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish to ride on the same question and request to know from the Chairperson; how many children have been left out in the streets and how many women are suffering? What measures are they taking to secure their good health because the scorching heat and cold in the night is too much and they are suffering?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, documentation of these IDPs who went to Uganda is not a secret. They are known which communities they originate from. Since that record is available to the Government, can these IDPs be given Kshs400,000 each that was favoured to the other IDPs who were in this country?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Allow me to ride on this very important requisition for a statement. I am privileged to be from the region where, originally, the IDPs who unfortunately found themselves in Uganda came from. They came from either Lwakhakha, Busia or Malaba. The Chairperson should explain and clarify to this House that since there is no record in Lwakhakha, Malaba or Busia of any property belonging to them – be it land or a shop – having been taken over by the locals, why are they finding it difficult to go back now that they have left Uganda?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, documentation of these IDPs who went to Uganda is not a secret. They are known which communities they originate from. Since that record is available to the Government, can these IDPs be given Kshs400,000 each that was favoured to the other IDPs who were in this country?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, pursuant to Standing Order No.45 (2) (b) , I rise to seek a statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations, regarding visa processing reciprocity between Kenya and European nations such as Switzerland and the United Kingdom (UK) .

In the statement, the Chairperson should explain the following:-

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is very straightforward State requirement. We will attempt to answer it within a week.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have a statement to make.

They are carrying banners. They are from Uganda.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, they are from Uganda.If they are from Uganda, they should go back to Uganda.

No, Mr. Speaker, Sir. It is my personal statement and not Sen. Adan’s.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, pursuant to Standing Order No.45 (2) (b) , I rise to seek a statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations, regarding visa processing reciprocity between Kenya and European nations such as Switzerland and the United Kingdom (UK) .

In the statement, the Chairperson should explain the following:-

Mr. Speaker, Sir, pursuant to Standing Order 45 (2) (a) , I rise to make a statement on an issue of a general topical concern regarding the plight of the Makonde people living in Kwale County.

The Makonde people are natives of Mozambique and Tanzania where they enjoy full recognition as citizens of the two countries. Kenya hosts a significant population of the Makonde people residing in Kwale County, who first came into the country over 50 years ago as labourers.

As I was coming, I saw they were demonstrating trying to reach State House. The population of Makonde has been increasing over the period to about 3,000 persons since they came to Kenya more than five decades ago. Despite the Makondes being almost as old in the country as Kenya itself, they remain unrecognized by the State and are thus Stateless.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, lack of recognition of the Makonde by the State has led to their stagnation, consigned to the fringe of society and entangled them in poverty as they cannot access formal employment for they do not have national identification documents.

Many of the Makonde have been born in Kenya and, therefore, as per Chapter 3 of the Constitution on Citizenship, are citizens of Kenya.Others are citizens by virtue of the time that they have spent in Kenya, which as I mentioned before, is approximately over 50 years. They can become naturalized citizens.

You will bring that statement on Wednesday, next week.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I will not be here. I have written to you that I will be going--- The Senate Minority Leader (

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the matter raised by the Chairman of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs is extremely important. Just like the Tesos, we have some in Kenya and also in Uganda. We have the Masaai and Kuria in both in Kenya and Tanzania. We have Luhya in Kenya and others in Uganda. Why is the Government failing to see that the Makonde people of Tanzania are the same Makonde people of Kenya?

The Constitution of Kenya at Article 15 (2) reads:- “A person who has been lawfully resident in Kenya for a continuous period of at least seven years and who satisfies the conditions prescribed by an Act of Parliament may apply to be registered as a citizen.”

Mr. Speaker, Sir, these people have been here for over 50 years. What are we still waiting for? In fact, I am surprised that the Office of the Registrar of Persons in this country is allowing this shame to continue, exposing the Jubilee Government for what it is; one that is not able to implement this Constitution. The Government should immediately offer registration documents to all these people who are our brothers and sisters in this country.

No, Mr. Speaker, Sir. It is my personal statement and not Sen. Adan’s.

Order, Members! Before we proceed with that particular Business, let me recognise the presence of visiting pupils and teachers from Umaa Primary School in Makueni County. They are sitting at the Public Gallery. In our usual tradition of receiving and welcoming visitors to Parliament, I extend a warm

fruitful visit.

Thank you.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, in applauding the statement by Sen. Haji, it would be best for this issue to be looked at wholistically and ask who the other marginalised communities or individuals suffering the same fate as Makonde people are. The issue should be addressed in addition to the ones that Sen. Haji has spoken about.

There are communities of a similar nature. There are more communities like the Makonde population in this country. Am I in order to request that when the Question will

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the matter raised by the Chairman of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs is extremely important. Just like the Tesos, we have some in Kenya and also in Uganda. We have the Masaai and Kuria in both in Kenya and Tanzania. We have Luhya in Kenya and others in Uganda. Why is the Government failing to see that the Makonde people of Tanzania are the same Makonde people of Kenya?

The Constitution of Kenya at Article 15 (2) reads:- “A person who has been lawfully resident in Kenya for a continuous period of at least seven years and who satisfies the conditions prescribed by an Act of Parliament may apply to be registered as a citizen.”

Mr. Speaker, Sir, these people have been here for over 50 years. What are we still waiting for? In fact, I am surprised that the Office of the Registrar of Persons in this country is allowing this shame to continue, exposing the Jubilee Government for what it is; one that is not able to implement this Constitution. The Government should immediately offer registration documents to all these people who are our brothers and sisters in this country.

Order, Members! Before we proceed with that particular Business, let me recognise the presence of visiting pupils and teachers from Umaa Primary School in Makueni County. They are sitting at the Public Gallery. In our usual tradition of receiving and welcoming visitors to Parliament, I extend a warm

Bw. Spika, ninataka kumshukuru Mhe. Haji kwa taarifa aliyoileta hapa Bungeni kuhusu jamii ya Makonde. Kupitia uongozi wa Spika wa Bunge hili jamii hii itapewa vitambulisho. Walipata masaibu mengi sana jana walipotoka Kwale kuja hapa Nairobi kuwasilisha malalamiko yao katika ofisi ya Rais. Wakiwa njiani walipata shida nyingi . Walishikwa pale Voi na Kwale. Walinyaganywa funguo za magari yao na hata pesa walizokuwa nazo mifukoni.

Bw. Spika, hawa ni wananchi wanateseka. Nikiendelea kuzungumzia mambo yale yamesemwa na Sen. Haji, ninaomba Wasomali wote pahali walipo wabadilishe jina lao. Ni afadhali wajulikane kama Waria. Kwa mfano, mimi nikienda Tanzania na ninataka kuishi huko nitabandikwa jina la Mkenya, lakini nitapewa kitambulisho cha Tanzania. Kwa hivyo, Wasomali wanaoishi hapa kutoka nchi ya Somalia wajiite Waria wa Kenya ili wapate vitambulisho na huduma zingine. Ukisema Msomali ni Msomali na wakutoka Somalia, basi hiyo italeta utata.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, in applauding the statement by Sen. Haji, it would be best for this issue to be looked at wholistically and ask who the other marginalised communities or individuals suffering the same fate as Makonde people are. The issue should be addressed in addition to the ones that Sen. Haji has spoken about.

There are communities of a similar nature. There are more communities like the Makonde population in this country. Am I in order to request that when the Question will

Bw. Spika, kwanza naomba kumpongeza kakangu, Sen. Haji. Ukweli ni kwamba mnyonge anyongwe lakini haki yake apewe. Mimi ni mzaliwa waVipingo. Jamii ya Makonde wanaishi Vipingo. Kwa hiyo, nitavaa junga niungane na jamii ya Makonde kwa sababu mimi nililelewa nao kule Vipingo. Makonde walikuwa wakikata makonge kule Vipingo. Tumekaa na wao Vipingo miaka mingi sana. Wazazi wao na babu zangu walikuwa wanafanya kazi mahali pamoja,

Kwa hivyo, ni huzuni kubwa kuona mimi nimekuwa Seneta na niko hapa na watu wangu ambao tulicheza nao nikiwa mchanga hawana vitambulisho. Ningekuwa nimetoka nje, watu wangeshangaa labda imekuwaaje kwa sababu ni watu ambao tulilelewa pamoja. Kwa hivyo, lazima tuona vile ambavyo tutawachukua kama jamii yetu. Ni watu wa kufanya kazi kwa bidii sana. Jamii yetu si wafanya kazi kama watu wa jamii ya Makonde. Kwa hivyo, hawa ni ndungu zetu, watoto na wazazi wetu.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. It will be in the great interest of this Senate to use this opportunity created by Sen. Haji to prepare a Motion for resolution of this House for the recognition of the Makonde Community under the Citizenship Act. That would be a resolution that this House can follow through. I am prepared to move such a Motion because then we can enforce it. The unfortunate thing about Kenya is that we recognise the people we should not recognise and the people we should recognise we ignore.

Kenyans would find it easier to become Australians because in four years they are recognised and they can vote. However, people who have been in this Republic for so long are mistreated. We have made citizenship look like acquiring blood from a stone. That is the best method and I propose, while thanking Sen. Haji, that we move in that process.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the plight of the Makonde people in this country actually is a shame. Looking at our first post-Independence Constitution which was drafted by our fore fathers like Jomo Kenyatta and Hon. Martin Shikuku, it recognised this fact. It provided that all foreigners who were living in Kenya at Independence Day would automatically become Kenya citizens if they applied. That is the constitution.

If you look at Article (15) (2) of the current Constitution, it is constantly abused by the Government to communities such as the Kuria, the Somalis and others. We have women who have been married to those communities from Tanzania who are in their 60s or 70s and have never been recognised up to now. We are abused because we are a community with, probably, the lowest population in this country. It is not proper. The Constitution must be followed.

I support Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.’s suggestion of a Motion so that this can be discussed in details and passed as a resolution in this House.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I want to thank all the Senators. These are Kenyans who came to our country in 1910. It is time we recognised the Makonde people as Kenyans. It is a pity that people who came here in 1910 do not have

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to join my colleagues in supporting the statement that was presented by Sen. Haji. Honestly, the Makonde problems have been highlighted severally in the press. However, I realise that there is no seriousness on the part of the Government.

As we await the issue to be resolved, quite a number of communities that live along borders have problems. They include the Somalis who are subjected to two vetting processes. I wish all Kenyans, including the Members of the Senate knew that we have a vetting community at the local level and a national committee.

There seems to be a deliberate attempt by the Government not to allow Somalis to recognise themselves as Kenyans just like what the Makondes are going through. So, the Cabinet Secretary needs to address this entirely as a matter that affects a number of genuine Kenyans and those who should have been naturalised like the Makonde people. Therefore, we expect an answer that will capture all people who are suffering across Kenya.

Bw. Spika, ninataka kumshukuru Mhe. Haji kwa taarifa aliyoileta hapa Bungeni kuhusu jamii ya Makonde. Kupitia uongozi wa Spika wa Bunge hili jamii hii itapewa vitambulisho. Walipata masaibu mengi sana jana walipotoka Kwale kuja hapa Nairobi kuwasilisha malalamiko yao katika ofisi ya Rais. Wakiwa njiani walipata shida nyingi . Walishikwa pale Voi na Kwale. Walinyaganywa funguo za magari yao na hata pesa walizokuwa nazo mifukoni.

Bw. Spika, hawa ni wananchi wanateseka. Nikiendelea kuzungumzia mambo yale yamesemwa na Sen. Haji, ninaomba Wasomali wote pahali walipo wabadilishe jina lao. Ni afadhali wajulikane kama Waria. Kwa mfano, mimi nikienda Tanzania na ninataka kuishi huko nitabandikwa jina la Mkenya, lakini nitapewa kitambulisho cha Tanzania. Kwa hivyo, Wasomali wanaoishi hapa kutoka nchi ya Somalia wajiite Waria wa Kenya ili wapate vitambulisho na huduma zingine. Ukisema Msomali ni Msomali na wakutoka Somalia, basi hiyo italeta utata.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Statement was requested around August and we were wondering what would happen by 1st October, 2016. We got the Statement on 9th August, 2016 when the House was on recess. Since the Statement may not serve what is currently happening, we need to take it back so that it can be updated. We have discussed this with Sen. Kagwe and he has agreed.

It is not the issue of Sen. Kagwe. You owe the House an apology.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Statement came on 9th August,

not recognizing them. It is important for us to appreciate Gov. Mvurya for petitioning the Government on this issue.

There is no other issue. Are there any requests? The Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget will answer a statement requested by Sen. Kagwe. He is entitled to ask for a statement as a Senator of Nyeri County.

Very well. It is okay now that you have apologized.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding of what Sen. Mositet has said is that he will bring an updated answer to this House because the one that was presented was overtaken by events. I just wanted him to clarify that, that is the position. Perhaps he could indicate to us when that Statement will be brought.

Do you still want 1st October as your deadline?

What is the date today?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, today is 13th October, 2016. We went on recess and when we came back, Sen. Kagwe was not around.

Order, Sen. Mositet. How many weeks was it to 1st October, 2016 when you received the request in August? All I am requesting is a humble apology to the House because that situation has had to be this way.

You have been given the opportunity as requested. It is ordered that you produce the Statement on Thursday next week.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I sought this Statement on 23rd February, 2016. At that time, the advert to allocate that land freely to unknown people had already been put up. As I speak, the allocation is going on despite the fact that there a lot of grievances by the residents of Machakos County. Under those circumstances, we should not keep moving this issue forward.

I seek the indulgence of the Vice Chair to at least order the stoppage of the allocation of the said land to allow for serious consultations with the stakeholders who have raised issues. When the advert was put up, they wrote to the NLC and the Ministry, seeking audience so that they can explain themselves and express the way things are, but they have been denied that opportunity.

The land is being given out. On Tuesday, there will be something else and Thursday is a national holiday. We will go on recess and by the time we come back, the land would have been given out. In this country land grabbing is real.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I need the indulgence of the Vice Chair.

Vice Chairman of the Committee, what do you have to say about that?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I apologized for the delay. It is true that the Statement was first sought on 1st March and not April; I have the full records.

My Committee has no powers to stop the allocation of land that is continuing. As I have said, we will respond to the issues that were raised by the Senator next week. If the

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding of what Sen. Mositet has said is that he will bring an updated answer to this House because the one that was presented was overtaken by events. I just wanted him to clarify that, that is the position. Perhaps he could indicate to us when that Statement will be brought.

Do you still want 1st October as your deadline?

No, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. In our discussion with Sen. Mositet, we talked about what would have happened by then. What he would presumably do now is to bring us a report of what transpired for the benefit of the House.

It is so ordered.

This is urgent because there is bureaucracy. Try to see whether you can summon the CS Lands and Urban Development within one week, but I am sure two weeks will be adequate for this. Two weeks puts us somewhere. Write to him and tell him that this is urgent. Summon him using all the powers that you have.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I could not agree more with your ruling. We will go by the instruction and write to the CS Lands and Urban Development to summon him to appear before the Committee of the Whole on Wednesday, next week.

However, I am not very comfortable with the words just used by the Chair with due respect, that you have lost confidence in the Committee to handle the matter. I request that this be expunged from our records because it is the same Committee that you are asking to summon the CS Lands and Urban Development. If you lost confidence in the Committee, then you would not be asking them to summon the CS.

I want to bring it to the attention of this House that answers do not come from the Committee but from the Ministry---

Order. If you listened to me carefully- I believe you are a good listener - I did not talk about this Chair losing confidence in the Committee. I talked about the questioner who is Sen.Muthama not being happy with the Committee’s handling of the issue, and has therefore, lost confidence. That is why I have made the other decision.

The Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula) : Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I do not want to get into this confidence issue. This Statement was written on 6th April,

the court process, so that there is an injunction. As a House and Committee, I do not think we have the powers to do that, as much as I sympathize the way he has put it.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I have raised the issue of this Statement more than five times. It is even in the HANSARD. What the Vice Chairperson Standing Committee on Lands and Natural Resources is saying is not true. The assurance has been: “Next week. Next Thursday. Next Tuesday.” It is, therefore, not true.

You are all right; from Sen. Wetangula, Sen. Khaniri and Sen. Muthama. Even when a Statement is not listed on the Order Paper, we have a leeway where the Committee Chairperson can say: “I have a Statement and I am ready to read it to the House.”

The idea of having the House Rules and Business Committee allocating time is neither here nor there, because you also have the powers to request to read the Statement. You are also correct that being an obedient observer of the laws and Order Papers of this House, then I give that leeway on your comment. All said and done, I conclude the way I have concluded. Let us have this done urgently.

If Sen. Muthama or Sen. Wetangula is interested, I can ask the Secretariat to do a postmortem and give us a report on how this report has been handled by the House. So, that is ordered. Can I have that report on the Speaker’s table to give us a true report because the Chair of the Committee is fairly or unfairly accused? Let us go to the next statement from the Chairperson, Standing Committee on Education. I do not see both the Chair and the questioner.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. The issue of fraudulent alienation of public land in this country is not a secret. In this particular case of Machakos County, we may invite the Vice Chair and the House to take judicial notice of the fact that the current Governor of Machakos County has been quoted in public media inviting people, particularly from the Middle East, to come to Machakos and be given free public land, which is held in trust for the people of Kenya in general and the people of Machakos County in particular.I would want the Chair to direct the Committee, deputized by my distinguished brother, Sen. Khaniri, to summon the Chairman of the NLC, the Minister for Lands, Housing and Urban Development, the Governor of Machakos County and put these facts to them, so that they can stop the reckless alienation of public land to persons who use it for speculation and not economic production.Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Vice Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands and Natural Resources has said that he does not accept the report that was submitted to the Committee.This report was done on the 6th April, 2016 and has been kept. The Committee has seen it for the last 10 months yet they have not acted. The answers are very shallow and totally unacceptable, yet the Committee is not accepting. What are we waiting for, this being October? Although the Vice Chairperson says that the Committee does not have powers, it can write and say that the issues raised, and the answers you gave us do not give justification for one to continue doing what they are doing.If this is the position written by the National Land Commission (NLC) Chairman and the Cabinet Secretary (CS) for Lands Housing and Urban Development - Prof. Kaimenyi, they are coming up with issues that are not addressing what is happening on the ground. Who is going to save the people of Machakos from having their land given freely to unknown people, yet they are saying: “We have 2,500 squatters?”There is an issue with the East African Portland Cement where the lease is very clear. It was given lease to mine minerals for making cement, but they are selling the land today. The people of Machakos are asking to be given an opportunity to purchase the land. However, the reply says that the land belongs to East Africa Portland Cement and the people of Machakos cannot buy it. It is being sold to foreigners by an institution owned by the public. Where are we going in this?

Very well. I have heard you clearly. Sen.Muthama, can you listen. I have heard what you and the Vice Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands and Natural Resources have said. The conclusion I make is that you have lost confidence in the Committee in handling this matter. That being the case, it may not be prudent or wise to do what I had hitherto ordered the Chairperson, Standing Committee on Lands and Natural Resources to do.

I will order that the CS, Ministry of Lands and Urban Development and his team that includes the Chairperson NLC, the Principal Secretary and all those officers that you as a Committee think are necessary should be invited to the House for a Committee of the Whole to give answers to this contentious issue as raised by the Senator for Machakos.

to circumvent the issues raised by Sen.Muthama.

I will request the CS Lands and Urban Development to use his powers to stop the sale of land in this contentious place. We do not have the powers as a House to injunct, but we can request as a House that the CS does that, which is my request.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir.

What is it, Sen.Muthama?

This is urgent because there is bureaucracy. Try to see whether you can summon the CS Lands and Urban Development within one week, but I am sure two weeks will be adequate for this. Two weeks puts us somewhere. Write to him and tell him that this is urgent. Summon him using all the powers that you have.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I could not agree more with your ruling. We will go by the instruction and write to the CS Lands and Urban Development to summon him to appear before the Committee of the Whole on Wednesday, next week.

However, I am not very comfortable with the words just used by the Chair with due respect, that you have lost confidence in the Committee to handle the matter. I request that this be expunged from our records because it is the same Committee that you are asking to summon the CS Lands and Urban Development. If you lost confidence in the Committee, then you would not be asking them to summon the CS.

I want to bring it to the attention of this House that answers do not come from the Committee but from the Ministry---

Order. If you listened to me carefully- I believe you are a good listener - I did not talk about this Chair losing confidence in the Committee. I talked about the questioner who is Sen.Muthama not being happy with the Committee’s handling of the issue, and has therefore, lost confidence. That is why I have made the other decision. The Senate Minority Leader (

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I do not want to get into this confidence issue. This Statement was written on 6th April,

Yes, Sen.Khaniri. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I agree that the Statement from the NLC came on 6th April, 2016. It is not the Chairperson Standing Committee on Lands and Natural Resources that schedules the business of this House, with all due respect. Statements are scheduled by the House Rules and Business Committee before they appear on the Order Paper. When they appear, it is now our duty to issue the Statement. However, I cannot schedule business on the Order Paper, with all due respect.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I have raised the issue of this Statement more than five times. It is even in the HANSARD. What the Vice Chairperson Standing Committee on Lands and Natural Resources is saying is not true. The assurance has been: “Next week. Next Thursday. Next Tuesday.” It is, therefore, not true.

Indeed, Sen. Wetangula, and

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Indeed, this statement has been pending in the House for a very long time. Last week, the presiding Speaker directed that this statement be issued today. I still want to insist that the urgency of this matter is serious. Farmers are waiting to know the fate of what has transpired since the said banks collapsed with their money, and KTDA which is responsible for this should assist the farmers because it is the last day today when money for the farmers is disbursed. This is important. I want to urge you to direct that this answer comes to the House soon before we break for recess.

I have received a request from Sen. Mositet. You need to put the request on the Floor of the House.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I am ready to move the business under Order No.10 on the Order Paper. However, my seconder is not there. When I was drafting this Motion, I had discussed it intensively with the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Education, Sen. Karaba. He was supposed to be my seconder. I request that we defer it until when he will be around.

Next to you is a former Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Education, Sen. Kagwe, among many other Members.

There is no Member who seems ready to second you. Very well, that is legitimate, we will defer this. Next Order!

If Narok County implements the policies they told us, they will make progress. However, in addition to matters ICT, the County Government was in a position to raise a lot more revenue if it got more support from the national Government. For example, the Narok County Government should be given conditional grants to develop infrastructure particularly the road network leading to national parks especially the Maasai Mara National Reserve.

The roads are in a bad state. This is one of the key areas where our tourists from all over the world, big and small, go to. No wonder tourism is not growing as fast as we would expect. We urge the national government, through this report, to support Narok County Government by facilitating road construction so that tourism can grow. Those roads are not just important for the Narok County Government or its people, they are important for Kenyans. Revenue that comes from tourism benefits Kenyans at large.

The Ministry of Devolution and National Planning should also conduct further civic education on the devolved system of government especially on the role of county assemblies vis-à-vis the county governments. In some of the counties that we went to, the committees of the assemblies on ICT were rather confused on the role they should play as far as engaging the county governments in ICT discussions is concerned. Therefore, the feeling we have had in over 30 counties that we have visited is that more needs to be done in civic education for county assemblies to understand what role to play in oversighting their own governments.

There is a mistaken notion that the CECs are supposed to be oversighted by this House. It should be made very clear that the work of the county assembly is to engage the so-called ministers in the county governments. It should be made very clear that it is not the role of the Senator to go and ask each County Executive Committee (CEC) member how the money allocated to their section is utilised. We should be engaging the governors to give us an overview of how the monies in the counties are being spent but the detailed oversight of department by department should be done by Members of County Assemblies (MCAs).

In some counties, they still do not understand what their role is. Therefore, the Ministry of Devolution and Planning should fund civic education. We also hope that the Senate will also be engaged, if it gets funding, to start civic education in the counties. Senators should have funds to go round counties informing the county citizenry what the role of a Senator is. This is because to date, you will still hear people expecting a Senator to construct a cattle dip, engage in numerous harambees and be the undertaker of various burials and so on.

It should be made very clear what the role of a Senator is, so that people can judge the work of a Senator. This is only possible if they understand our roles. You cannot judge an individual or an office unless you know what the role of that office is. People will continue to be confused as long as there is insufficient civic education.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, any form of civic education like what was done before the 2010 Constitution was passed requires money. Honestly, people will be expecting too much. How are people supposed to understand their Constitution if no civic education is being carried out across the country by anybody?

(Motion deferred) What is it, Sen. Wetangula?

want to go and run for governorships because people can clearly see governors sitting with them and the projects they are doing without minding that the resources for doing so are passed by this House because of the lack of the understanding and impatience of even legislators to allow the idea to be understood by the society. That is why many Senators and other people desire to become governors. We feel that it is very important and this Report indicates so, that there is need for civic education across the country.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, we also recommend that the Ministry of Information, Communication and Technology (ICT) engages the Kenya Power so that the Kenya Power can also begin to roll out fiber optic cables along their power lines to create redundancies for the fiber that exist underground.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, when we went to Bomet, we found that there is redundancy of underground fiber because of people digging and rains and so on. Therefore, we request the ICT Authority to engage the Kenya Power, so that the Kenya Power can run similar fiber optic cables. When a cable running alongside a power lines has a problem, people can use the underground one, and when the underground ones have issues, then we can use the power cables. In other words, one will serve as a substitute of the other.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, in terms of revenue allocation, we felt very strongly that a minimum of 5 per cent of the monies allocated to counties should be reserved for ICT work. We have come from an ICT benchmarking trip in Japan with my colleagues of the Committee on Information and Technology. I am sure they will discuss this when they get an opportunity to contribute. What we saw in those countries and what we have in this country is such that if we are not careful, we, as a country, and Africa as whole, we will once again be relegated to nothingness.

We were surprised about the seriousness with which those governments give the area of ICT. The Government of Japan is very committed to matters of ICT. Those are countries that are already developed by far. They are already 200 or 300 years ahead of us. If they go ahead and implement ICT in the manner in which we witnessed and we do it at the pace and speed and the ignorance with which we are implementing ours, those countries will be 600 or 700 years ahead of us. This is not a joke. It is something that countries must look at very seriously.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, when we went to Rwanda, we were impressed with what the Rwandese Government has been trying to do. In Rwanda, the Minister for ICT is the President himself because of the seriousness with which they are looking at this issue.

In Japan, in 2020, a person will be able to stand in front of a mirror in the morning as he or she dresses up and the mirror would tell their blood pressure (BP), their cholesterol level and any sort of medical issues they have. Today, you have to go to Nairobi Hospital and spend three weeks to get that kind of information. While we were in Japan, Sen. Cheruiyot was told his BP, heartbeat rate and everything when he stood in front of the mirror. This is where and how far the world has gone yet we are still toiling around on whether we should have a paperless Senate or not. The world has moved on regarding matters of ICT. Therefore, it is time for us to think.

Indeed, Sen. Wetangula, and

America (USA) has made tremendous steps regarding the use of ICT. President Obama has a unit within the White House that deals with matters of ICT, creates and resolves problems using ICT. That alone makes one to understand and have a grasp of where the world is going and how far back we are being left.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Ohio State Government received an award of USD40 million from the Federal Government of the USA for improvement as far as governance is concerned by use of ICT. The Ohio State Government was given low marks for financial transparency in 2014, earning an F from the USA Public Interest Research Group; a national non-governmental organisation that monitors the relationships between citizens and Government. However, the State received A-ratings in 2015 and 2016 from the same organisation.

The story behind that is that remarkable turnaround can be provided by experts from the elements of state government that have enhanced citizens’ ability to observe their states, use of taxpayers’ funds and related functions and access the benefits of the state. This was done by implementing ICT solutions to some of the challenges that they were facing. We are talking about a state in the USA and so on. We are impressed with what we heard and read. The question is; where will Kenya be in that state of affairs?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, in 2007, I was then the Minister for Information and Communication. We set up to build a structure in Kenya where the cost of internet was going to be equal to or less than that in India. The reason being that the counties that were and are still engaged in the outsourcing businesses tend to name India as the place where they outsource their business. As we try to create more jobs in our country, it is important to note that one of the fastest growing sectors in our economy is the ICT sector and mobile phones, but we are not growing fast enough and we are not taking the opportunities that we could.

We have a Cabinet Secretary for Information, Communications and Technology (ICT) who is infused. He is an ICT guru and understands ICT very well. All we need to do is to support him, his departments and enthuse energy.When it comes to budgeting, the Treasury should allocate sufficient funds to the Ministry of ICT in order for the Ministry to be able to make the changes that are necessary for it to make its input as an enabling Ministry to all the other Ministries. As a country and Government, we need to do a lot more in placing ICT where it belongs.

When you see the ICT input that the other countries put in agricultural research and the way they handle crop husbandry through the use of ICT, you then realize that we should have been the first ones to implement this technology because we are the ones who rely more on agriculture than any other country. Japan invests massive amounts of money in managing agriculture via ICT yet it does not base its economy on agriculture. However, it appreciates the importance of agriculture in terms of food security for it leads to national stability. It does not matter how civilized or how advanced people are, they still need to eat. Therefore, ICT is an enabling area and the Ministry must be funded adequately.

For the last ten years,the Government has always given disappointing results every year even when you get to the point where you think that they now appreciate the importance of ICT and will, therefore, fund the Ministry sufficiently. Therefore, on

Secretary, Mr. Henry Rotich, and the National Assembly that is charged with the responsibility of overseeing the budget process to think very hard about the implementation of a viable ICT Ministry as they allocate money.They should also look at all the areas that ICT can assist and how to implement ICT solutions to the many challenges that Kenya has.

I am sure that Kenya will be a very proud nation if we can give sufficient allocation to this Ministry just the way we are proud of M-pesa when we go out of this country.The team that was in Japan was very proud when they said that Kenya was the first country on earth to launch a mobile money transfer system. We are so proud to make such a statement, but it is getting old. M-pesa will be ten years old next year. We cannot keep on singing the same song over and over.

The time has come for us to do other things that we can also say that Kenya is the first country in the world to implement. When we do so, we will create the kind of confidence to make Kenya an ICT investment destination for those companies dealing with ICT globally.

With those few remarks, I beg to move that the Senate adopts the report and ask Sen. (Prof.) Lesan to second the Motion.

I have received a request from Sen. Mositet. You need to put the request on the Floor of the House.

selfish. They should extend this kind of knowledge and experience that they have had with other counties.

One of such counties is my own county that the Chairperson has actually mentioned. Bomet County is very allergic to anything ICT and that is very sad. The only time they embraced a bit of ICT is when they were forced to accept Integrated Financial Management Information System (IFMIS) because it was the only way they could access money. It is sad to see Bomet County present handwritten documents which have been erased and some of them have been written in ball pens and pencils.

These are usually very important documents dealing with accountability of funds that have been used in counties being presented to the County Public Accounts and Investments Committee.They are really awful documents that cannot support anything. In fact, it is a manifestation of very poor management of not only the personnel but also money.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I would like to use my county as an example to request every other county that has not fully embraced Information and Communications Technology (ICT) to do so. If they do not do so, I can only infer that there is only one reason why they do not do it. It is because they have a capacity to conceal theft and fraudulent use of money by using systems that do not leave any trail behind. ICT would leave a trail behind. If you are honest with the use of public money, you would use a system that will leave a trail. You can demonstrate to others that funds have been put to good use. The counties that have not been able to use ICT, including my county, five years down the line, will be exposed. It will be clear, by the number of those who will be called upon to account for resources that have been wasted or fraudulently acquired.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I do not want to belabour so much the importance of ICT in counties. This is one of the most important pieces of equipment, technique and system that counties need to use. In a few months, there will be a devolution conference to look at what devolution has done over the years. I am in the committee which is organizing the conference. Some awards will be given to people who have made a contribution to devolution. I will be the happiest person if ICT systems would be among those which will win awards for making a contribution to the success of devolution. The counties which have embraced ICT will be some of the winners of these awards, and not some individuals who have been making noise all over the country.

As the Chairperson said, ICT has been very useful in various areas. I, particularly being a medic and coming from a medical background, know that ICT has made a contribution to the practice and delivery of medical services the world over. It has done so also in this country. I applaud the Government for supplying sophisticated equipment to health service providers which are being used to enhance treatment. We can draw maximum benefits from the equipment. It will assist us to run Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI), Computerized Tomography (CT) scan and a whole lot of diagnostic equipment. They would have maxim benefits if we tie them together with ICT. This is evident in counties that have embraced ICT.

There is the last mile connectivity of equipment that is to be used in ICT. During our visits to various counties, we noted that there are areas which the counties can assist in order for the equipment, wiring and introduction of ICT to take place more efficiently;

Next to you is a former Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Education, Sen. Kagwe, among many other Members.

There is no Member who seems ready to second you. Very well, that is legitimate, we will defer this. Next Order!

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I thank you for giving me this chance to add my voice in support of the good work that has been done by a Committee that I have come to admire so much. I do not say this because I am a proud Member. The work they do is testament. For the few months that I have been a Member of this House, I have had an opportunity to read through some of the reports that are generated. While they are a brilliant work that I can speak highly of, this report is excellent. I have taken time to internalize the things that are being suggested.

As a Senate whose primary mandate is to support the establishment of devolution in this country, the question that keeps coming on and on during our discussions, debates and interactions as Members of this House is, what is it that we can do to make sure that devolution succeeds and the dreams of the drafters of our Constitution are realised through this great direction that we took as a country. I would like to speak to three key things but before I go to the crux of my argument, there are two things I have realised this afternoon.

As I listened to arguments being made by the Chairperson of my Committee and the seconder, the Senator for Bomet, Sen. (Prof.) Lesan, I have realised that; first, I think ICT is a solution to all the challenges that our county governments are facing. Later on, I will expound on this and give a proper overview of why ICT stands as the single item with which if we decided to invest and put our time and money into it, it can help us leverage on and overcome some of the challenges that we keep on referring to as teething problems in this very onset of devolution in our country.

Secondly, I think anyone who intends to run for the position of governor in the next elections will do very poorly if he or she lacks ICT skills and without an ICT master plan in their manifestoes. This is because more and more county residents have realised the importance of ICT. The county that has been mentioned as being allergic to matters of ICTdevelopment will serve as a very bad example. I am sure that one of the things that

House of records, is that some counties have grown their revenue collection fivefold by simply adapting the use of ICT in revenue collection. You then wonder what it is that stops a governor who truly believes that devolution is for service to the people and not an avenue to pilferage public property and make yourself rich. What will make such an individual not to adopt this system?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, there are many living examples around us. As we move towards the end of this first round of county governments, I think it will be important that we urge county residents to ask their governors for their ICT successes. Of late, it has been said that when you look at the things that ICT has done in this world, then you realise that for sure it is a game changer. They say that the biggest hotel today in the world is a company called AB & B but it has no single hotel property. The biggest taxi company in the world is Uber but they do not have a single vehicle. That is the magic of ICT. Then, you wonder what people are waiting for. Why can we not adopt some of the recommendations that are being made through such reports?

The other day, my Committee had a discussion and we said that we need to question county governments on their budgetary allocations to ICT. We are really worried and we feel that our story is not being heard properly. In many counties,you realise that among the items with the least budgetary allocation is the ICT segment.Yet, they do not realise that the more you invest in this sector the more you are likely to get a breakthrough even in terms of revenue collection.

By accessing internet services,that little boy or girl in the dusty villages of my county of Kericho can get as much information as a girl growing up in California which is the tech city of the world. This is because through ICT, you can access as much information as possible. The little child will then have an equal chance of succeeding as those growing up in the “first worlds” of this country. It is my hope and desire that people will realise how useful it can be if we leverage on the use of ICT and use it even in our daily operations in county governments.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I had the privilege of travelling with my Committee to Japan for a period of one week. We went to study a myriad of issues. While learning and taking notes, I could not help but imagine how we could localize some of the solutions that I saw. Part of the problems that we keep seeing every day in our county governments can be avoided.

In the area of disaster management, for example, I know this is a challenge that most counties face each day. You may have a sick person but you cannot even access the many ambulances that counties parade as one of their achievements. It is because you have to know the chief who has to call so-and-so to call the CEC in charge of health for them to release an ambulance to rescue a patient. By the time you do this, maybe the person will have passed on. If you leverage on ICT such that you get to know each resident of a county and give them a unique code upon whose activation you can know the closest ambulance to them and how quickly it can get to them.

Insecurity is a challenge even to the country let alone counties. For example, it is only Nairobi and Mombasa that were wired under that national programme of installation of CCTVs. What about the other 45 counties? What is it that you are prioritizing to ensure that security is improved? We were challenged that if we wanted to know how

will not be called by police officers to pick it, you will find it where you dropped it. We were shocked to learn that the crime rate is almost at 0 per cent because you are being watched whether you walk down to the subways or along the streets. People can monitor you and know who you are and what you are doing.

These are not very expensive things that we cannot do. You then wonder what attitude is this that we need to change.If you have the hardware but your software, as an individual, is not inclined to think that ICT is a solution to your problems, then you will face an extremely difficult time. I challenge those of us who are in influential leadership positions that when you get a chance to address your county assemblies, please, tell them to look at the issues of budgetary allocation to their ICT departments.

ICT is not just about providing cyber cafes. I have seen in certain counties the only glory that the governor takes is in saying that he has set up a cyber café in a particular ward and they consider that to be a success. It is about inculcating the use of ICT in almost all operations and making it as flawless as possible. Think about issues of corruption and the loss of public funds that we keep discussing.For example, when the Integrated Financial Management Information System (IFMIS) was introduced to county governments, it took a whole lot of convincing and we even had to enact laws to force people to adapt to it.

Finally, citizen participation is something that our Constitution places right at the centre of our democracy. All counties did something called County Integrated Development Plans (CIDP). What if all citizens had embraced the use of ICT such that this document was readily available in our smart phones? At this time, we would be questioning our governors according to what they were supposed to have achieved in the ward, sub-county or entire county. That would be an easy way of tracking development. You do not have to walk to the offices of the county assembly to ask for the budget plans and what has been set aside.

We need digital governments which can think about the future and know that ICT is a solution and not part of the challenge. If you are not embracing it, then you are being left behind each day that you are not embracing the use of ICT in your operations and that your county is losing out.

With those many remarks, I beg to support.

Secretary, Mr. Henry Rotich, and the National Assembly that is charged with the responsibility of overseeing the budget process to think very hard about the implementation of a viable ICT Ministry as they allocate money.They should also look at all the areas that ICT can assist and how to implement ICT solutions to the many challenges that Kenya has.

I am sure that Kenya will be a very proud nation if we can give sufficient allocation to this Ministry just the way we are proud of M-pesa when we go out of this country.The team that was in Japan was very proud when they said that Kenya was the first country on earth to launch a mobile money transfer system. We are so proud to make such a statement, but it is getting old. M-pesa will be ten years old next year. We cannot keep on singing the same song over and over.

The time has come for us to do other things that we can also say that Kenya is the first country in the world to implement. When we do so, we will create the kind of confidence to make Kenya an ICT investment destination for those companies dealing with ICT globally.

With those few remarks, I beg to move that the Senate adopts the report and ask Sen. (Prof.) Lesan to second the Motion.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I rise to second the adoption of this Report which has been ably moved by the Chairperson of the Committee on Information and Technology. I want to thank the Committee for the seriousness with which they have approached this work.

I would like to take this chance, having been a Member of this Committee before I moved to another Committee, to thank the Chairperson of the Committee who has a vast of experience in matters of ICT, having been the former Information Minister. He has been selfless in giving all the information and the expertise he has gained over the years to this Senate Committee for it to perform. This Committee is, indeed, performing and that can be seen from the reports that they present to this House.

I also want to compliment the various counties in this country which have, in the very first instance, taken it upon themselves to accept that ICT is useful and have gone ahead to embrace and use it. As a Member of this Committee, I was one of those who visited various counties. I was impressed with what Uasin Gishu, Nakuru, Nyeri and Kericho counties have done in terms of ICT. They have used ICT to the maximum benefit for the people of their counties. The counties that have embraced ICT were keen on recruiting the right personnel to man the equipment for maximum benefit and they also purchased the best available equipment.

These were counties that faced challenge in revenue collection. They immediately recognized that ICT was one of the things that they could use to increase their revenue.The Committee reports that these counties that embraced ICT have demonstrated tremendous increase in their revenue collection as a result of embracing ICT. We want to

selfish. They should extend this kind of knowledge and experience that they have had with other counties.

One of such counties is my own county that the Chairperson has actually mentioned. Bomet County is very allergic to anything ICT and that is very sad. The only time they embraced a bit of ICT is when they were forced to accept Integrated Financial Management Information System (IFMIS) because it was the only way they could access money. It is sad to see Bomet County present handwritten documents which have been erased and some of them have been written in ball pens and pencils.

These are usually very important documents dealing with accountability of funds that have been used in counties being presented to the County Public Accounts and Investments Committee.They are really awful documents that cannot support anything. In fact, it is a manifestation of very poor management of not only the personnel but also money.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I would like to use my county as an example to request every other county that has not fully embraced Information and Communications Technology (ICT) to do so. If they do not do so, I can only infer that there is only one reason why they do not do it. It is because they have a capacity to conceal theft and fraudulent use of money by using systems that do not leave any trail behind. ICT would leave a trail behind. If you are honest with the use of public money, you would use a system that will leave a trail. You can demonstrate to others that funds have been put to good use. The counties that have not been able to use ICT, including my county, five years down the line, will be exposed. It will be clear, by the number of those who will be called upon to account for resources that have been wasted or fraudulently acquired.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I do not want to belabour so much the importance of ICT in counties. This is one of the most important pieces of equipment, technique and system that counties need to use. In a few months, there will be a devolution conference to look at what devolution has done over the years. I am in the committee which is organizing the conference. Some awards will be given to people who have made a contribution to devolution. I will be the happiest person if ICT systems would be among those which will win awards for making a contribution to the success of devolution. The counties which have embraced ICT will be some of the winners of these awards, and not some individuals who have been making noise all over the country.

As the Chairperson said, ICT has been very useful in various areas. I, particularly being a medic and coming from a medical background, know that ICT has made a contribution to the practice and delivery of medical services the world over. It has done so also in this country. I applaud the Government for supplying sophisticated equipment to health service providers which are being used to enhance treatment. We can draw maximum benefits from the equipment. It will assist us to run Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI), Computerized Tomography (CT) scan and a whole lot of diagnostic equipment. They would have maxim benefits if we tie them together with ICT. This is evident in counties that have embraced ICT.

There is the last mile connectivity of equipment that is to be used in ICT. During our visits to various counties, we noted that there are areas which the counties can assist in order for the equipment, wiring and introduction of ICT to take place more efficiently;

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. In Parliament we make laws. When one withdraws Kshs1 Million, he needs to substantiate the source. The law requires transfer to where the owner wants to use it. Therefore, he need not carry lots of money. It is a risk to the owner. This is intended to remove the risk from individuals.

If we want to help our country we must first embrace ICT. It will help us to be more accountable in all that we do in this country. With ICT, our people will be able to know what is happening within and outside the country. Nobody will bother us with questions because they will have information at their fingertips. People will trust each other because they will be getting the right information. University students and even high schools will find running fun because of ICT. Nowadays everything is done online. For example, students apply to join Kenya Medical Training College (KMTC) and other colleges online.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, finally, I urge our military forces to embrace ICT. They must go digital because that is the way to go. For example, during their recruitment exercise so many deserving cases are left out. How can we help an orphan who struggles to go to school be recruited in the Kenya Defence Forces, Regular Police or Administration Police? This is a person who was educated by a good Samaritan. Their system of recruitment is so rigid that children from disadvantaged backgrounds cannot be employed. If they embraced ICT, all those interested would apply through online and probably be employed.

I support this Motion and urge all institutions in our country that have not embraced ICT to do so. The security systems in this country must embrace ICT. They should not be left behind when other sectors have already moved ahead with ICT.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, with those few remarks, I beg to support and thank the Committee on ICT. I hope the recommendations as contained in this Report will be implemented by the concerned Ministry.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I wish to support this Motion that has been brought to the House by the Committee on Information, Communication and Technology that is ably led by the former Minister for Information, Communication and Technology in the Republic of Kenya. Hopefully, the Chairperson

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I thank you for giving me this chance to add my voice in support of the good work that has been done by a Committee that I have come to admire so much. I do not say this because I am a proud Member. The work they do is testament. For the few months that I have been a Member of this House, I have had an opportunity to read through some of the reports that are generated. While they are a brilliant work that I can speak highly of, this report is excellent. I have taken time to internalize the things that are being suggested.

As a Senate whose primary mandate is to support the establishment of devolution in this country, the question that keeps coming on and on during our discussions, debates and interactions as Members of this House is, what is it that we can do to make sure that devolution succeeds and the dreams of the drafters of our Constitution are realised through this great direction that we took as a country. I would like to speak to three key things but before I go to the crux of my argument, there are two things I have realised this afternoon.

As I listened to arguments being made by the Chairperson of my Committee and the seconder, the Senator for Bomet, Sen. (Prof.) Lesan, I have realised that; first, I think ICT is a solution to all the challenges that our county governments are facing. Later on, I will expound on this and give a proper overview of why ICT stands as the single item with which if we decided to invest and put our time and money into it, it can help us leverage on and overcome some of the challenges that we keep on referring to as teething problems in this very onset of devolution in our country.

Secondly, I think anyone who intends to run for the position of governor in the next elections will do very poorly if he or she lacks ICT skills and without an ICT master plan in their manifestoes. This is because more and more county residents have realised the importance of ICT. The county that has been mentioned as being allergic to matters of ICTdevelopment will serve as a very bad example. I am sure that one of the things that

House of records, is that some counties have grown their revenue collection fivefold by simply adapting the use of ICT in revenue collection. You then wonder what it is that stops a governor who truly believes that devolution is for service to the people and not an avenue to pilferage public property and make yourself rich. What will make such an individual not to adopt this system?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, there are many living examples around us. As we move towards the end of this first round of county governments, I think it will be important that we urge county residents to ask their governors for their ICT successes. Of late, it has been said that when you look at the things that ICT has done in this world, then you realise that for sure it is a game changer. They say that the biggest hotel today in the world is a company called AB & B but it has no single hotel property. The biggest taxi company in the world is Uber but they do not have a single vehicle. That is the magic of ICT. Then, you wonder what people are waiting for. Why can we not adopt some of the recommendations that are being made through such reports?

The other day, my Committee had a discussion and we said that we need to question county governments on their budgetary allocations to ICT. We are really worried and we feel that our story is not being heard properly. In many counties,you realise that among the items with the least budgetary allocation is the ICT segment.Yet, they do not realise that the more you invest in this sector the more you are likely to get a breakthrough even in terms of revenue collection.

By accessing internet services,that little boy or girl in the dusty villages of my county of Kericho can get as much information as a girl growing up in California which is the tech city of the world. This is because through ICT, you can access as much information as possible. The little child will then have an equal chance of succeeding as those growing up in the “first worlds” of this country. It is my hope and desire that people will realise how useful it can be if we leverage on the use of ICT and use it even in our daily operations in county governments.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I had the privilege of travelling with my Committee to Japan for a period of one week. We went to study a myriad of issues. While learning and taking notes, I could not help but imagine how we could localize some of the solutions that I saw. Part of the problems that we keep seeing every day in our county governments can be avoided.

In the area of disaster management, for example, I know this is a challenge that most counties face each day. You may have a sick person but you cannot even access the many ambulances that counties parade as one of their achievements. It is because you have to know the chief who has to call so-and-so to call the CEC in charge of health for them to release an ambulance to rescue a patient. By the time you do this, maybe the person will have passed on. If you leverage on ICT such that you get to know each resident of a county and give them a unique code upon whose activation you can know the closest ambulance to them and how quickly it can get to them.

Insecurity is a challenge even to the country let alone counties. For example, it is only Nairobi and Mombasa that were wired under that national programme of installation of CCTVs. What about the other 45 counties? What is it that you are prioritizing to ensure that security is improved? We were challenged that if we wanted to know how

will not be called by police officers to pick it, you will find it where you dropped it. We were shocked to learn that the crime rate is almost at 0 per cent because you are being watched whether you walk down to the subways or along the streets. People can monitor you and know who you are and what you are doing.

These are not very expensive things that we cannot do. You then wonder what attitude is this that we need to change.If you have the hardware but your software, as an individual, is not inclined to think that ICT is a solution to your problems, then you will face an extremely difficult time. I challenge those of us who are in influential leadership positions that when you get a chance to address your county assemblies, please, tell them to look at the issues of budgetary allocation to their ICT departments.

ICT is not just about providing cyber cafes. I have seen in certain counties the only glory that the governor takes is in saying that he has set up a cyber café in a particular ward and they consider that to be a success. It is about inculcating the use of ICT in almost all operations and making it as flawless as possible. Think about issues of corruption and the loss of public funds that we keep discussing.For example, when the Integrated Financial Management Information System (IFMIS) was introduced to county governments, it took a whole lot of convincing and we even had to enact laws to force people to adapt to it.

Finally, citizen participation is something that our Constitution places right at the centre of our democracy. All counties did something called County Integrated Development Plans (CIDP). What if all citizens had embraced the use of ICT such that this document was readily available in our smart phones? At this time, we would be questioning our governors according to what they were supposed to have achieved in the ward, sub-county or entire county. That would be an easy way of tracking development. You do not have to walk to the offices of the county assembly to ask for the budget plans and what has been set aside.

We need digital governments which can think about the future and know that ICT is a solution and not part of the challenge. If you are not embracing it, then you are being left behind each day that you are not embracing the use of ICT in your operations and that your county is losing out.

With those many remarks, I beg to support.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I also rise to support the adoption of the Report. I also thank the Chairperson. I think among the Chairpersons in this House, we always salute the Senator for Nyeri County in the education sector and now in ICT and many others.He has always been committed and ensures that when he takes over, he shows exemplary leadership in terms of achieving what every committee wishes to achieve.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you have seen the challenges we have faced with many Government tenders and access to information. I thank the President for ensuring that his Government is digital. That is the way to go. We have had many challenges with the technocrats who feel that for the last 20 years, they have been doing business their own way. They always have in-trays, among others.

I think he is in order. On the other hand, you are not in order because it was a Select Committee Report and not a CORD report. You did a good job as a Member of that Committee and you should be proud. You should ensure that connectivity is achieved in every part of the country.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Is Sen. Elachi, the Senate Majority Whip and a senior Member of this House, in order to castigate and bring in bad light a hardworking deputy governor in this Republic? Out of hard work, he managed to have in cash Kshs3.5 Million in the evening while going home. What is the problem of having Kshs3.5 Million in cash?

Does the Senator have information or she imagines that this could be county resources in one way or another like it happens in other counties? In other counties, people go home with county resources. Could she shed some light on that issue so that she does not give the impression that it is wrong to have Kshs3.5 Million?

Britain that, provision of fiber optic and internet infrastructure is as basic as the provision of water, electricity and telephone. I hope that we will get to that level. Unfortunately, we are still at a stage where 60 per cent of the population in some counties defecates in the open and 80 per cent of the population draws water from wells, ponds and lakes. Therefore, we need to first address these basic, bread and butter issues. Let our people defecate decently, get clean drinking water and then get to the level where we can provide ICT infrastructure as a basic service. We need to look at ICT beyond the traditional applications.

When the Chairman of the Committee presented his report, he talked about the ‘business as usual’ applications of technology in the counties that he visited. We must go further than that and look at the use of ICT in telemedicine. Counties have got serious equipment in the hospitals which are lying idle because the governors say that they do not expertise to manage the equipment. We could do telemedicine that has been tested elsewhere and seen to work. Our farmers are suffering losses because of changes in the climate.

When I was in financial services, we invented an insurance product that used technology. It was called a Weather Index Based Insurance Solution which used technology to detect if the temperature went too high or rainfall went too low. If crops failed or livestock died as a result of changes in climatic conditions, the insurance company could pay. This is a solution that counties that engage in pastoralism and in serious agriculture can implement. We should not just look at technology as using Integrated Financial Management Information System (IFMIS), using Integrated Payroll and Personnel Database (IPPD) or having a website and a Twitter handle.

With regard to time and attendance systems, we have a lot of ghost workers in these counties. We are told that there was a Capacity Assessment and Rationalization of the Public Service (CARPS) that was happening. Since the former Cabinet Secretary, Ann Waiguru, left office we have not heard anything about the CARPS exercise. As a result, most counties are stuck with employees in the payrolls, some of whom are ghosts, aliens, human beings and others political sycophants who are in payrolls and being disguised as doctors. We need to have a situation where anyone who reports to work in the counties uses a thumbprint, so that we can distinguish the ghosts from the real people. Therefore, ICT can be applied so broadly to have value in our counties.

As I conclude, being digital will not be fashionable---

You can get another two minutes, since you have not finished.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for your kindness. In 2013, being digital was seen as fashionable. It was a strong campaign messaging that some people were digital and others analogue. This time round, there is no luxury in being analogue and being digital will not be fashionable; it will be imperative for every player in the political contest. I want to encourage everyone in political contestation or a position of executive authority that being digital should not be seen as an option; it

example, to help our farmers and pastoralists.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, there is a project I did using technology to prevent unwanted pregnancies by using SMS notifications to young girls so as to help them understand their menstrual cycles. This ensured that many young girls could stay in school and many working class mothers could continue to be productive and plan for their future and their livelihoods. I encourage counties to use technology innovatively and move beyond the traditional use of IFMIS.

To the Council of Governors (CoGs) and the chairman, we are tired of the complaints about IFMIS and IPPD every day. We need to look for another excuse and that is the reason processes are not being undertaken in counties. If there is no connectivity, go to CAK and picket. Blow whistles, like I have done in the past and got results, and you will get answers on why the Kshs5 billion USF is not being used for its intended purposes.

I support.

because each county executive and county assembly will feel that they have a mandate to establish their own ICT infrastructure. We, as Senate must encourage counties to move progressively towards shared services so that we can reduce the expenditure or infrastructure that comes with technology.

Another matter that we need to encourage as a Senate is development of incubation centres at the counties. We must move the technology incubation centres from Nairobi. When you look at technology innovation, it still flows like the ideas behind Sessional Paper No.10. There are several technology hubs and labs in Nairobi. There is Naihub, ihub and others. You can count up to ten innovation hubs in Nairobi, but when you go further afield, the further you go outside Nairobi, the fewer the innovation labs become.

Within the entire lake region which covers about six counties, there is only one innovation lab called Lake Hub. They are doing very badly. They are not getting funding and sometimes the question is who should fund them. Is it the Ministry of Information, Communication and Technology or is it the county government? I believe that counties should be able to step into some of these things and encourage the development of innovation hubs.

At a minimum, the way we have said that each county needs to have a university or an airport, if we are serious about this ICT revolution. We must also say that each county must have a technology innovation hub. That should be driven by county governments and not necessarily by Members of the National Assembly through Constituency Development Fund (CDF) as I have seen the proposal coming from the Ministry of Information, Communication and Technology. Issues of innovation, incubation and laboratories to foster technological breakthrough should be coordinated by the county governments. Members of the National Assembly should come in to plug in into the broader plans that the county governments have come up with, which should be consistent with the national plans.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the county governments that we represent have complained about inefficiencies and weaknesses in the performance of the IFMIS and the other platforms that is used for personnel management Integrated Payroll and Personnel Department (IPPD). There are certain counties where they say that they only get connectivity for 25 minutes. The Chair of the Council of Governors is on record asserting Lamu as one of the counties where business cannot go on because they lack connectivity.

There is a Universal Service Fund (USF) that is established by statute. About 0.5 per cent of the revenues that Safaricom Limited makes annually go into a fund that is being managed by a civil servant within the Communications Authority of Kenya (CAK). Right now, the fund is valued at close to Kshs5 billion. The objective of this fund is to ensure that in Kajiado and the northern part of Kenya there is no pocket or corner without mobile network coverage.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, when we say that the next election shall be electronic, will we be able to get network coverage throughout the country? Are we serious when we say that we will scan and transmit the forms from the polling stations electronically? Do we know whether there is full coverage countrywide? I see a Member

came out of Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) Select Committee; that the next election shall be electronic.

I do not begrudge the assumption---

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Is the Senator for Homa Bay in order? He knows very well that, that proposal was from the CORD Coalition and we adopted it. I thank God because he is now telling Kenyans that what we told them is true; it can never happen. Is he in order to say that I am looking at him interestingly, yet it was their proposal?

kwamba daktari akisema jambo unaweza kuangalia wakati huo huona ujue huo ugonjwa ulivyo, vile utakavyotibiwa na athari zake ni gani. Ninamuunga mkono Sen.Kagwe na ninaomba tuende mbio na sisi, tucheze kwa mtindo mmoja na nchi zingine kwa kuwa teknolojia ikituacha, tutakuwa tumeachwa nyuma.Teknolojia ni mawimbi ambayo hayatatungojea kamwe. Kwa hivyo, lazima na sisi tuwe palepale kwenye ufuo wa bahari ili tusaidike.

Ni lazima vijana wetu walio kwenye jeshi watoke nje na kusoma kuhusu vilipuzi. Uliona tulichelewa siku za Westgate kwa sababu vijana wetu hawakuwa na ile teknolojia.

Uliona tulichelewa kwa sababu vijana wetu hawakuwa kwenye teknolojia. Ilibidi watu watoke nje. Unaona ni gharama iliyoje kuchukua watu ambao wako nje wanaojifanya wana ujuzi na sisi tunaujuzi. Pia, kama nilivyosema vipakatalishi zimekuja wakati mzuri. Ukiangalia mpaka pale nyuma, watoto wetu akili zao ni chapchap kwa sababu ukishindwa na kitu kwenye simu, itabidi uite kijana.

Kama unavyoona, Serikali imezingatia mambo ya vijana wetu kwa kuona kuwa lazima wapewe vipakatalishi, lazima wawe na ile elimu ambayo mtoto mwingine yeyote ama lazima apewe ule wakati mwafaka kwa sababu ukipata kipakatalishi kutokea darasa la kwanza, watoto wetu hawatakuwa bure bali watakuwa wataalamu.

Kwa hivyo, Bw. Spika wa Muda, mimi kama mama ninasema hongera sana. Hii teknolojia isambazwe hadi kila shirika liweze kuwa na teknolojia ambayo inahusiana na ile kazi mtu anafanya. Kwa hayo mengi, ninasema shukrani na nampa pongezi Sen. Kagwe.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I also believe they did a good job. If the fund is to do what it is supposed to, then the proposal by the Select Committee is valid. You would expect that Kshs5 billion sitting with the CAK would not be laundered by the civil servants. It would be used to expand mobile coverage across the country.

In a county like Homa Bay, which people might think is fairly exposed, there are certain corners and pockets where there is no mobile network coverage. If a polling station falls within that particular pocket, the electronic election idea will not be achieved. It is important for the Senate to interrogate the Universal Service Fund (USF) and ask how the monies have been used. For example, if you gave me Kshs5 billion and I do not account for it, there is nothing that stops me from running for governor of Nairobi or governor for Homa Bay because I have a slush fund.

We also need to encourage counties to embrace professionalism when it comes to technology. If an accountant has to be employed, we insist that he or she must be a member of the Institute of Certified Public Accountants of Kenya (ICPAK) . An engineer must be a member of the Institute of Engineers of Kenya. A human resources professional must be a member of the Institute of Human Resource Management (IHRM) . What about the people who manage information technology, yet they have passwords and access to the most confidential files? It is time we legislated and put in place a certification framework for Information Communication Technology (ICT) professionals.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, we have a body called the Computer Society of Kenya (CSK) . I am a technology profession but I am not a member of that society. I prefer to be a member of the British Computer Society (BCS) because the CSK is a briefcase organisation. The select Committee said that we should call the CSK to sit with other stakeholders to decide on the ICT policy on elections. You will get a briefcase carrier who will pretend to carry the aspirations of professionals.

For those of us who are professionals and sit in this House, we need to have a certification, validation and accreditation scheme, so that when a county employs a chief information officer, there is the assurance that, that person belongs to a professional body. The same way we will have a chief finance officer in the counties, we need to have a chief information officer who will be responsible for the digital assets of the counties.

ways and means of generating revenue. One of the ways is ensuring that we seal the existing loopholes in terms of the local revenue generation.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, most of the counties – it is saddening – are generating less revenue than what used to be collected by the defunct local authorities yet through every year, the Finance Bills in our county assemblies always expand the taxation bracket. Now, you find counties collecting taxes and levies on things that local authorities previously did not collect taxes on. If you were to work with simple mathematics, you would expect that county governments would now be collecting much more; double or triple of what local authorities were collecting previously.

However, the true position is that they are collecting less yet they expanded the taxation base. This is precipitated by the fact that there are serious loopholes in the collection of revenue. Use of ICT would provide an excellent opportunity to seal those loopholes. You go to a parking in the counties, you pay for your parking fee and you are given a receipt.

In one of the incidences in my county, Boda boda operators are charged on daily basis by the county government and they are given receipts. We discovered that some of unscrupulous businessmen working in collusion with county officials had developed fake receipts which they issued to Boda boda operators which means you are losing a lot of revenue to some of these unscrupulous businessmen working in cahoots with our county officials. If you want to seal this loophole, you must engage ICT solutions. This will ensure you are able to net all the resources.

It does not make sense that a county will charge Boda boda operators, small business persons working in kiosks without providing the necessary facilities just because you are unable to collect all these resources into the county coffers and provide the facilities that these business persons need from the county. Therefore, I encourage all the county governments, particularly my county; that they need to focus on ICT solutions to seal the existing loopholes in revenue collection.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the other important aspect of ICT is that it can be a good solution to provide job opportunities for our young people. We have the incubation centres that exist in Nairobi. I would expect that county governments, whenever they work on their budgets as a matter of priority, allocate adequate resources to the departments of ICT to come up with incubation centres in our counties because it is one area that you can absorb a lot of our young people who are already interested in ICT. If you go to every village, you meet a young person already operating a smart phone but we need to find a proper way of ensuring that some of these interests in ICT products are escalated to the point of generating revenue through them.

I would be interested to see a county government supporting young people through the Youth Enterprise Development Programmes to set up ICT hubs in our counties. This will engage the young people in meaningful development programmes and issues that are of particular interest to them. That is an important aspect that I think county governments must deal with. Of course, one of the impediments to entrenchment of ICT in our counties is lack of proper budgetary allocations. If there is one particular challenge other than corruption that bedevils devolution is misplaced priorities. When you go to a county, as a matter of fact, health is priority and so is infrastructure.

You can get another two minutes, since you have not finished.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for your kindness. In 2013, being digital was seen as fashionable. It was a strong campaign messaging that some people were digital and others analogue. This time round, there is no luxury in being analogue and being digital will not be fashionable; it will be imperative for every player in the political contest. I want to encourage everyone in political contestation or a position of executive authority that being digital should not be seen as an option; it

example, to help our farmers and pastoralists.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, there is a project I did using technology to prevent unwanted pregnancies by using SMS notifications to young girls so as to help them understand their menstrual cycles. This ensured that many young girls could stay in school and many working class mothers could continue to be productive and plan for their future and their livelihoods. I encourage counties to use technology innovatively and move beyond the traditional use of IFMIS.

To the Council of Governors (CoGs) and the chairman, we are tired of the complaints about IFMIS and IPPD every day. We need to look for another excuse and that is the reason processes are not being undertaken in counties. If there is no connectivity, go to CAK and picket. Blow whistles, like I have done in the past and got results, and you will get answers on why the Kshs5 billion USF is not being used for its intended purposes.

I support.

Well done Senator. You got the extra two minutes because you are a guru in that field.

information to Kenyans.

The reason why we are talking about information or new technology is because we want Kenyans to know what is happening on issues of resource allocation and even our Constitution. Let me talk about the roles of Senators and Members of the National Assembly and those of Members of County Assemblies (MCAs). Many people do not know the roles of these leaders. I do not know whether it is because as Members of Parliament (MPs), we are used to going to the community to fundraise to the extent that Kenyans do not know the roles of MPs and MCAs. The same information should be disseminated to communities though technology.

My two concerns are that all counties should embrace technology and be concerned about setting a budget for the same. They should also have specific officers to deal with civic education of all kinds so long as it is something that is touching the lives of Kenyans.

I take this opportunity to thank the Chairperson of this Committee for visiting counties to see what is happening in the departments of ICT. I also encourage them to make sure that their resolutions are implemented to the letter.

With those few remarks, I support the Report.

kiteknolojia. Vijana wetu wanatakiwa waende kwa mafunzo kama hayo ili tusitishwe na Al Shaabab ambao wanatumia vilipuzi kwa kutumia teknolojia ambayo sisi wenyewe hatujui kuvizuia vile vilipuzi. Kwa hivyo, tunaona ya kwamba lazima tuwe wajuzi wa teknolojia ili tuone ni nini tutalofanya ikiwa tumekabiliwa na shida kama hizo.

Lazima bajeti iweko kwa sababu mkono mtupu haulambwi. Lazima kila kaunti na Serikali kuu zitenge maeneo fulani kwa mafunzo kama hayo. Kila kaunti iwe itaweka pesa kwa sababu chanda chema lazima kivikwe pete. Tuone ya kwamba kila kaunti itaweka pesa ambazo zitatosha kwa sababu pesa adimu hazitatusaidia. Ni lazima tuichukue teknolojia kama kitu ambacho tutakiweka mbele. Mbwa hawezi kukuuma ukimjua jina. Kwa hivyo, laazima tuikubali teknolojia kama kitu kizuri kwetu.

Bw. Spika wa muda, kuna watu wengi wanaoiogopa teknolojia. Hadi leo kuna watu ambao hawataki simu. Mtu anataka kitu ambacho atakishika mkononi lakini akiambiwa: “Huu ujumbe utakufuata.” hataki. Lazima sisi kama Wakenya tukubali kwenda na vile hali ilivyo kwa mageuzi, sambamba na nchi zingine. Tusikubali kuwekwa nyuma. Wakati ni ukuta, na mtu akipigana nao ataumia mwenyewe.

Nimeinuka hapa ili kusema kwamba, lazima tuichukue teknolojia kama kitu ambacho sasa hivi kila mtu amebadilika. Lazima sote tubadilike na kutafuta njia ambayo ni nyepesi kwetu ili tuishi katika nchi yetu. Sisi huwa na aibu sana tukienda nchi za nje tukiona wenzetu walivyo mbele. Ukiangalia mabasi yenyewe hujirudisha chini ili wenye baiskeli wapande kwa urahisi. Huna haja ya kupiga kengele kusema basi isimame kwa kuwa maandishi yajipitisha yenyewe. Twalia kwa sababu tuko nyuma kiteknolojia.

Bw. Spika umesikia Sen. Kagwe akilia na kushangaa. Anaona aibu mbona sisi bado tuko nyuma. Hii ni kwa sababu hapa kwetu tuko nyuma kwa sababu hatutaki mawazo mapya. Kama unavyojua, kipya kinyemi. Kwa nini tusifuate kitu kipya? Kwa nini tusigange yanayokuja kwa sababu yaliyopita si ndwele? Nawaambia wenzangu na watu wote kwenye kaunti kwamba tuwe tukiletewa vitu vipya tuvikubali ili teknolojia itupeleke mbele.

Pia mawasiliano ni teknolojia. Yanatufuata mpaka nyumbani mwetu ama vyumbani mwetu. Hata hivyo, hii teknolojia yatupeleka mrengo mwingine kwa sababu utaona inachukua wakati wetu mwingi sana na kuachana na familia zetu. Vile tunavyotaka teknolojia, lazima tuivalie njuga. Tuangalie kuwa ni lazima tujumuike na familia zetu na tusiwe kwenye mtandao sana. Pia, tuletewe teknolojia ambazo hazitakuwa mbaya kwa miili yetu.

Bw. Spika, mengi siku hizi huenda rahisi sana kwenye mtandao. Kwa mfano, hakuna ugonjwa ambao huwezi kuuangalia kwenye Youtube. Jana nimeeshangaa nilipokuwa naangalia tiba ya ugonjwa fulani. Mara hiyo, nikaona kwamba teknolojia imenisaidia. Nilienda jikoni kwangu saa hiyo hiyo na nikaelekezwa kwamba niongeze tumeric yaani bizari mbichi, halafu niongeze chumvi ambayo iko kwenye kila jiko la mwanamke.

Kwa hivyo, hii teknolojia imetuletea mambo mazuri. Imetutoa kwenye ujinga. Wakati mwingine huwezi kuenda mahali fulani kwa sababu mawasiliano yatakufuata mpaka pale pale nyumbani. Itakufanya usitumie pesa kusema lazima uende mji fulani au nchi fulani. Ukifika kule utakuwa umeangalia na kujua daktari amesema nini. Zamani, daktari angekuja, aongee - wajua madaktari wanaongea ni kama wale wengine

kwamba daktari akisema jambo unaweza kuangalia wakati huo huona ujue huo ugonjwa ulivyo, vile utakavyotibiwa na athari zake ni gani. Ninamuunga mkono Sen.Kagwe na ninaomba tuende mbio na sisi, tucheze kwa mtindo mmoja na nchi zingine kwa kuwa teknolojia ikituacha, tutakuwa tumeachwa nyuma.Teknolojia ni mawimbi ambayo hayatatungojea kamwe. Kwa hivyo, lazima na sisi tuwe palepale kwenye ufuo wa bahari ili tusaidike.

Ni lazima vijana wetu walio kwenye jeshi watoke nje na kusoma kuhusu vilipuzi. Uliona tulichelewa siku za Westgate kwa sababu vijana wetu hawakuwa na ile teknolojia.

Uliona tulichelewa kwa sababu vijana wetu hawakuwa kwenye teknolojia. Ilibidi watu watoke nje. Unaona ni gharama iliyoje kuchukua watu ambao wako nje wanaojifanya wana ujuzi na sisi tunaujuzi. Pia, kama nilivyosema vipakatalishi zimekuja wakati mzuri. Ukiangalia mpaka pale nyuma, watoto wetu akili zao ni chapchap kwa sababu ukishindwa na kitu kwenye simu, itabidi uite kijana.

Kama unavyoona, Serikali imezingatia mambo ya vijana wetu kwa kuona kuwa lazima wapewe vipakatalishi, lazima wawe na ile elimu ambayo mtoto mwingine yeyote ama lazima apewe ule wakati mwafaka kwa sababu ukipata kipakatalishi kutokea darasa la kwanza, watoto wetu hawatakuwa bure bali watakuwa wataalamu.

Kwa hivyo, Bw. Spika wa Muda, mimi kama mama ninasema hongera sana. Hii teknolojia isambazwe hadi kila shirika liweze kuwa na teknolojia ambayo inahusiana na ile kazi mtu anafanya. Kwa hayo mengi, ninasema shukrani na nampa pongezi Sen. Kagwe.

complete and then the person is paid. The communities served by this project are totally cut out. They begin crying too late to Senators when they have petitions.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I do not know whether the mover of this Motion wants to reply. Sen. Kagwe is looking at the clock all the time. You should have just told me rather than straining your eyes.

I do not want to make life difficult for my dear friends.

ways and means of generating revenue. One of the ways is ensuring that we seal the existing loopholes in terms of the local revenue generation.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, most of the counties – it is saddening – are generating less revenue than what used to be collected by the defunct local authorities yet through every year, the Finance Bills in our county assemblies always expand the taxation bracket. Now, you find counties collecting taxes and levies on things that local authorities previously did not collect taxes on. If you were to work with simple mathematics, you would expect that county governments would now be collecting much more; double or triple of what local authorities were collecting previously.

However, the true position is that they are collecting less yet they expanded the taxation base. This is precipitated by the fact that there are serious loopholes in the collection of revenue. Use of ICT would provide an excellent opportunity to seal those loopholes. You go to a parking in the counties, you pay for your parking fee and you are given a receipt.

In one of the incidences in my county, Boda boda operators are charged on daily basis by the county government and they are given receipts. We discovered that some of unscrupulous businessmen working in collusion with county officials had developed fake receipts which they issued to Boda boda operators which means you are losing a lot of revenue to some of these unscrupulous businessmen working in cahoots with our county officials. If you want to seal this loophole, you must engage ICT solutions. This will ensure you are able to net all the resources.

It does not make sense that a county will charge Boda boda operators, small business persons working in kiosks without providing the necessary facilities just because you are unable to collect all these resources into the county coffers and provide the facilities that these business persons need from the county. Therefore, I encourage all the county governments, particularly my county; that they need to focus on ICT solutions to seal the existing loopholes in revenue collection.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the other important aspect of ICT is that it can be a good solution to provide job opportunities for our young people. We have the incubation centres that exist in Nairobi. I would expect that county governments, whenever they work on their budgets as a matter of priority, allocate adequate resources to the departments of ICT to come up with incubation centres in our counties because it is one area that you can absorb a lot of our young people who are already interested in ICT. If you go to every village, you meet a young person already operating a smart phone but we need to find a proper way of ensuring that some of these interests in ICT products are escalated to the point of generating revenue through them.

I would be interested to see a county government supporting young people through the Youth Enterprise Development Programmes to set up ICT hubs in our counties. This will engage the young people in meaningful development programmes and issues that are of particular interest to them. That is an important aspect that I think county governments must deal with. Of course, one of the impediments to entrenchment of ICT in our counties is lack of proper budgetary allocations. If there is one particular challenge other than corruption that bedevils devolution is misplaced priorities. When you go to a county, as a matter of fact, health is priority and so is infrastructure.

I call on the mover of the Motion to reply.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. First, I thank all the colleagues who have contributed to the Motion. I particularly thank Sen. (Prof.) Anyang’-Nyong’o, my friend and former teacher for teaching me good manners so that I did not want to tell him anything. I just looked at the watch and he got the message.

The contributions have been very effective. Clearly, there is a passion and interest in this House for ICT. We hope that we can infuse the county governments and legislatures so that the enthusiasm runs across the country. Those of us who will eventually be governors next year have a very important role to play going forward in this matter. They can centralise and make themselves the ICT ministers just like President Kagame made himself the ICT Minister in Rwanda. Only then will we see the kind of results that we would like to see.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I promise those who made contributions and suggestions that the Committee will take their views seriously. We will present all the ideas to the Committee, the Cabinet Secretary for Information, Communication and Technology and if possible, to the President. I want to thank everyone who participated and the Speaker for his patience.

With those few remarks, I beg to move.

resources in projects that do not have meaning and direct impact on them.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, once they are done with resource allocation, counties must be faithful to ensure that they execute the budget as indicated. I come from a county where the budget is one thing while implementation of programmes indicated in the budget is a totally different thing. For three years, my county government has allocated resources to bursary but none of the needy deserving students in Nandi County have received bursaries in the last three years. What is the need of a budget if you will work on it yet you are unable to expend resources as indicated in it.

Therefore, it is not just good enough that we allocate resources to these sectors in the budget but it is also important that we remain faithful in implementation of the programmes and projects contained in the budget. With those remarks, I congratulate this Committee. I urge all the county governments, that ICT is not negotiable.

I beg to support.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I rise to contribute on this Report. First, I thank the Chairman of the Committee on Information and Technology. He has articulated important issues about information to the citizens of this country both at the national Government and the county assembly. My colleague Senators have talked about collection and expenditure of resources.

I wonder why people in the counties do not know what is happening in their counties. The managers of the counties do not want to embrace ICT. It is unfortunate. If a county does not want to embrace technology, it means there is something fishy going on in that county. We would like the people of this country to know what is happening in their counties and the national Government.

The Chairperson of this Committee mentioned civic education. I am not talking about civic education on the Constitution only but civic education on various things that are happening in our country. For instance, resources that the Government has planned to devolve to the counties to assist orphans, old people, women and youth. In most cases, many people do not know about these funds. They do not know how they can access these funds. They lack information because they are not connected to ICT.

Fifteen years ago, we used to queue at the telephone booth to make calls. People could take more than one hour, queuing to make a call.

A Chief Executive Officer (CEO) could write a letter, hand it to a typist or secretary for typing who then took it back to the boss to sign and then make a day to take it to the post office and wait for another four days for any kind of reply. There is no way we can avoid technology. Neither can we say that counties should not use technology.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, let me talk about a resource center in each sub- county. If today all the 47 counties were connected with ICT, I wonder if sub-counties would know what is going on if they are not also connected to a server. So, it is my request and maybe advice to this same Committee that as much as we are talking about counties, we also need to talk about sub-counties. This is because it is the only centre where people can receive information very easily. So, it is my request that we should embrace technology and do a budget for the same because it cannot work without a

information to Kenyans.

The reason why we are talking about information or new technology is because we want Kenyans to know what is happening on issues of resource allocation and even our Constitution. Let me talk about the roles of Senators and Members of the National Assembly and those of Members of County Assemblies (MCAs). Many people do not know the roles of these leaders. I do not know whether it is because as Members of Parliament (MPs), we are used to going to the community to fundraise to the extent that Kenyans do not know the roles of MPs and MCAs. The same information should be disseminated to communities though technology.

My two concerns are that all counties should embrace technology and be concerned about setting a budget for the same. They should also have specific officers to deal with civic education of all kinds so long as it is something that is touching the lives of Kenyans.

I take this opportunity to thank the Chairperson of this Committee for visiting counties to see what is happening in the departments of ICT. I also encourage them to make sure that their resolutions are implemented to the letter.

With those few remarks, I support the Report.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I also rise to support this Motion and the Report of the Committee. I am glad that this evening my colleagues have made very strong presentations on pubic participation. I listened to Sen. Sang and Sen. Chelule emphasize the need for adopting the use of ICT in public participation.

Beginning with this Senate, whenever we have had public participation, particularly those that we hold at the Kenya International Convention Center (KICC) , the Senate mainly uses the print media to communicate to people that we will have public participation. If it goes further, it uses radio. That is the technology of the 1950s. Radios and newspapers have been there all these while. Now, we are in the era of internet and, in fact, even people in the rural areas get messages on their phones. Otherwise, they would not be buying or subscribing to all these services that Safaricom offers. I think we should encourage it, beginning with this Senate, that communication with the public is now online.

There should be a Senate session online on Frequency Module (FM) stations, Twitter, WhatsApp among others so that you can communicate with the people through a medium that they have access to.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the typical way by which county governments get people into public participation is not for the governor to announce that there will be public participation on a market day in a place like Akala or Kombewa knowing that people will be at the market. The day chosen for public participation is completely wrong. This is because people have gone to the market that day for a completely different business which is commerce. Then, you want to divert the attention into public participation. You will find the lay-abouts that will pay attention and so on.

In the County Governments Act, the structure of devolution went up to the village level. The village council is composed of five people one third of which must be of either

happens in the county, it has to be felt at the village level.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, if I want to have public participation, for God’s sake, let it begin at the village level. The information must be sent to the village council. We should not assume that these people are ignorant. If they were ignorant, they would not have elected us in the first place or let us not assume that they do not have preferences in terms of development and choosing the projects they want in their areas.

The participation must be cascaded upwards from the village council to the ward administrator, sub-county administrator and finally participation is held. Participation should be structured and then you can hold someone accountable for not calling people to participate. Secondly, the information that you want to convey to people must be available to them ahead of time. That is why online services are there. There must be someone in the village that has an email. In my village, I can point out a couple of people with emails. The village administrator should have an email. My local market must have some printing services. If they are not there, they should be available at the village administrator’s office.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, if we are talking of public participation, let us not limit ourselves by saying that people should make an input into a programme. Let us also think of the structure of participation and know which technology can assist us get information. That is why it is called Information and Communication Technology and not just technology in abstract but in reality. Having access to that technology means knowing it and knowing how to use it. Let us not think of technology as something complicated. After all, using a jembe or lighting a lamp is technology. So, let us find that information highway that makes it possible for people to have input, criticisms or programmes that we have to implement at the county level.

We must participate in order to contribute and get feedback. So, once you participate in the making of the County Integrated Development Program (CIDP) you need to get feedback. When you discuss the Budget in the National Assembly and the Senate, what is the outcome? In the Senate, the outcome of voting for the allocation of funds for the counties is the Auditor-General auditing the use of county funds. He then tables the Report in the House so that it is discussed in the County Public Accounts and Investments Committee. The Committee summons the governors to give feedback.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it is important - I hope Sen. Sang comes up with a Bill on public participation - to have a Bill feedback system by which once the county residents contribute to an issue like CIDP, they should get feedback from the same county.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, project implementation is very important. The Constituencies Development Fund (CDF), for example, provides for Project Management Committees (PMCs). When you are building a classroom, you do not begin doing the work until there is a PMC. The PMC is the owner of the project on behalf of the people. They are the ones who give feedback and hold the CDF accountable. They are also held accountable by the people to ensure that the project is implemented properly.

In the present county governments system, the idea of PMCs is loud by its absence. The person held responsible for doing a contract is the person apparently who should also account for what he has done. How does he do it? When the people from the

Hon. Senators, there being no other business, the House stands adjourned until Tuesday, 18th October, 2016, at 2.30 p.m.

The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m.

Order Sen. Mutahi Kagwe! Who gave you the permission to speak?

Sorry, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to support.

I call on the mover of the Motion to reply.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. First, I thank all the colleagues who have contributed to the Motion. I particularly thank Sen. (Prof.) Anyang’-Nyong’o, my friend and former teacher for teaching me good manners so that I did not want to tell him anything. I just looked at the watch and he got the message.

The contributions have been very effective. Clearly, there is a passion and interest in this House for ICT. We hope that we can infuse the county governments and legislatures so that the enthusiasm runs across the country. Those of us who will eventually be governors next year have a very important role to play going forward in this matter. They can centralise and make themselves the ICT ministers just like President Kagame made himself the ICT Minister in Rwanda. Only then will we see the kind of results that we would like to see.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I promise those who made contributions and suggestions that the Committee will take their views seriously. We will present all the ideas to the Committee, the Cabinet Secretary for Information, Communication and Technology and if possible, to the President. I want to thank everyone who participated and the Speaker for his patience.

With those few remarks, I beg to move.

This is a Motion which does not affect counties. I will proceed and put the question.

Hon. Senators, there being no other business, the House stands adjourned until Tuesday, 18th October, 2016, at 2.30 p.m.

The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m.